Several techs have reported cutting a doped pinblock and seeing the pintite went no farther than the 1st layer...could be that superthin CA glue goes no farther, but there have been a lot of good results from CA if you can't replace the block... David Ilvedson, RPT Pacifica, CA 94044 ----- Original message ---------------------------------------- From: nature.dude <nature.dude at yahoo.com> To: pianotech at ptg.org Received: 10/5/2009 6:52:36 PM Subject: [pianotech] Pin-Tite >I was reading the following article below regarding Pin-Tite. I find it interesting. >It seems like many techs are confusing pianos treated with Pin-Tite with pianos >treated with antifreeze? Maybe? Below is the article. What do you all think? >(article: http://www.player-care.com/pintite.html) >Facts About Pin-Tite� > by Craig Brougher >I also want to answer in regard to what I feel is not a fair assessment in >regard to Pin-Tite and the Guild. It was said by Doug Rhodes that the fact >that nothing had ever been written about Pin-Tite in the last 15 years of >the Journal stands as mute testimony to the "fact" that the PTG does not >endorse pin tighteners. >While it is true that no official articles have been written on pin tighteners >(which would require a comparison test between potential advertisers in the >Journal), neither have there been evaluations of technician schools (which the >PTG doesn't endorse or rate, either.) After all, Charles Flaum included their lack of >endorsement as proof, too. The Piano Manufacturer's >Association has never in its history endorsed any after market product, yet >Charles and Doug are, by inference, including this as a proof that Pin-Tite is >damaging to pin planks. Charles said that the entire industry is clearly opposed >to it since no one in the industry endorses it. Doug seconds that motion. As I >will show, that is incorrect. >Pin tighteners got a bad rap when, in the 50s and 60s (around here, at least) >it was said that Mobil Oil Co's antifreeze was as close to pin tightener as >you could get and at the time sold for about 50 cents a qt. So armed with no >knowledge and trusting completely on hearsay, dozens of tuners in this city >filled their bottles with it and ruined thousands of wrest planks. Not that >other brands wouldn't do just as good a job of ruining them, but the tuners >saved the $3.85/plank. This wave went around the country for about 10-15 >years. >Finally, tuners known to do this got a bad reputation, and suddenly the entire >guild ran as far away from pin tighteners the other way as they could get. >They went from one ridiculous extreme to the other. Never ever trying to find >out if, in fact there was actually something to do the job safely and >permanently (as proven by the total lack of research done by the PTG and >admitted by Doug and Charles as well). >It was lots easier to just throw the baby out with the bathwater. Lump all pin >tighteners together and pretend they didn't exist. They are presently in this >mode yet today, fearful that they will be labeled, otherwise. >Anybody who says they use it is immediately persona-non-grata. That's why I >did it! I enjoy being "their" persona-non-grata. It gives me a lot of pleasure >and confidence. I enjoy it. Besides, I, and thousands of other legitimate (but >very quiet) users of Pin-Tite are not the exception, and there are some very >fine PTG techs I know who swear by it! Just not very loudly, lest they be >labeled a "hack," which pleases some, and right here on this MMD page! That >doesn't bother me. I know what's right and I always stick up for those things. >People know they can trust what I say. >I think that if a man does not fear what other people will think, he will not >simply go with the flow, but will be honest and curious about trying to learn >what and why. If anybody is actually interested, a chemist could explain how a >resin impregnation system is permanent and cannot possibly hurt any wood >product. I'm surprized that so far no one has said, "I think it an important >enough subject to warrant further study, and to prove one way or the other." >Instead, all I have read is, "I don't know, and I don't care to find out." >The principle behind all of the early pin tighteners is this: Glycerine in >alcohol is absorbed by the wood. The alcohol evaporates, leaving glycerine >behind. Glycerine has a great affinity for moisture, and so, draws water out >of the air to join with it. As moisture is adsorbed, it fills the spaces, >increasing hydrostatic pressure in the plank. This crushes the wood tightly >around the pins until most of the space is taken up by the moisture entrained. >The pins rust eventually, not from the glycerine, but from the moisture in the >air. The next thing that happens is this: The glycerine migrates away from the >pins and gradually finds its way deep into the plank, where it no longer can >be of use. The powerful action of wood to wick liquids is stronger than the >glycerine's ability to stay where it is. So gradually, the water then leaves >the wood. When it does, it leaves behind a crushed cellular stucture which has >destroyed the plank. Sometimes they can be repinned, but it isn't likely. And >the pin holes seem "mushy" to tune, and never seem to hold a tuning. >If you had repinned several of these planks, only to have your customers >breathing fire down your neck, you would know why tuners ran as fast as they >could from pin tighteners. >Now comes Pin-Tite. It was formulated by a real live chemist who knew how to >do it. He ran years of experiments. I have spoken to his widow about it, and >the tests which were done to prove it. Her son today is a professional chemist >who supervises its manufacture and tests it. It doesn't rely on water >retention/compression at all! It is made from the resins which come from wood >and a delivery system which allows the wood to "absorb" it, NOT just entrain >it. That means, it is not simply a coating but an integral part of the pin >hole area which chemically reacts with cellulose, dries completely, and >becomes a permanent part of the plank again. There is nothing in Pin-Tite that >does not come from wood. The resultant tuning is a restored plank, with that >nice little pin "jump" restored, just like Bruce Clark and others want to >feel. >Pin-Tite will not work well on any plank previously treated with a glycol or >any other system which relies on water retention. You are wasting your money. >However, despite the PTG's fearful silence on Pin-Tite, you must realize that >all of these products have been advertised in the PTG Journal, and that all of >these products are still sold by the carload! And guess who buys them? PTG >members! That, friends, is the ultimate endorsement. It's just that they don't >talk about it anymore, lest the stigma is also applied to them. One day, this >will be corrected, but until physical principles are respected and trusted, >the same taint will be applied to all who use it. Ridiculous! >E-Mail to: Craig Brougher >Phone No: 816-254-1693 >NOTICE: >The third parties mentioned in this article have been contacted and >asked to present any scientific and/or practical information which >refutes Mr. Brougher's comments. Thusfar, none have responded. For the >position of the Piano Technicians Guild regarding all commercially available products, >including Tuning Pin Tighteners, >click here. For other opposing and agreeing articles written about the use of Tuning >Pin Tighteners and Loose Tuning Pins, >click here. The hyperlinks within this paragraph are just a small part of the Archives >located at the Mechanical Music Digest website. >
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