[pianotech] CTE's - what are you thoughts? (continuation of Re: Old can of worms)

[Tom Gorley]

It seems that all the responses are from "former" CTE's, and each of them remembers a little differently. During my tenure, in setting master tunings no ETD was allowed in the room. Three or more tuners had to agree on a setting before the tuning could continue.  After the tuning was considered complete, the ETD was brought in to record the results.

A computer compared the master tuning results with the applicants tuning.  The scoring is entirely objective. The CTE makes no subjective assessment.

I have not been up on rules changes. Why not just look up today's rules  ?  It's no secret.

---Tom G

>    Tom Gorley
> Registered Piano Technician    
>       (650) 948-9522




On May 12, 2012, at 2:58 PM, tnrwim at aol.com wrote:

> 
> I'm curious to know if things have changed in the last several years. When I was a CTE, the master tuning was done totally aurally by a CTE as best he/she could. Then two others came in and they all three went over the tuning with a fine tooth comb to make it as good an aural tuning as possible for that particular piano. Then that was recorded into the ETD.and became the Master Tuning against which other tunings were measured.
> This is the way the master tuning is done. The piano may initially be tuned using an ETD, but then the CTE, and two other RPT's aurally go over the piano, tweaking the tuning to the best of their combined ability. The final result is then entered into the ETD. The examinees' tuning is then entered into the ETD, and the two are compared by the program in the ETD. Only the CTE knows which notes are "bad", which the other two RPT's and the examinee then verifies as being 'bad", or if the notes are acceptable.
>  
> Wim
> 
>  
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Avery Todd <ptuner1 at gmail.com>
> To: pianotech <pianotech at ptg.org>
> Sent: Sat, May 12, 2012 11:28 am
> Subject: Re: [pianotech] CTE's - what are you thoughts? (continuation of Re: Old can of worms)
> 
> I'm curious to know if things have changed in the last several years. When I was a CTE, the master tuning was done totally aurally by a CTE as best he/she could. Then two others came in and they all three went over the tuning with a fine tooth comb to make it as good an aural tuning as possible for that particular piano. Then that was recorded into the ETD.and became the Master Tuning against which other tunings were measured.
>  
> And to even become a CTE, one's tuning had to be done totally aurally and score 90 or above in ALL categories. Maybe others did it differently but in Houston, that's the way it was done at that time. Admittedly, that was several years ago and maybe things are different now. But I became a CTE with a totally aural tuning. No ETD's allowed for the tuning itself. 
> Avery Todd
> On Sat, May 12, 2012 at 3:00 PM, David Renaud <drjazzca at gmail.com> wrote:
> Actually, your wrong, yes it is scored with aural criteria, are the intervals"pleasing" aurally,
> Or do they offend.
> 
> Here is how it works.
> 
> The scoring computer program "earmarks" notes outside parameters, That may of may not become Deductions.  Only one of the 3 examiners know what the computer scoring program says. The other 2 people on the examination team do not have a clue what the computer scoring program says.  The one examiner that knows where the earmarked notes are will request particular notes at his discretion to be aurally checked. The others do not know if it is a good note, bad note, flat or sharp, no clue. They check the note carefully with purely aural checks.
> They must determine on their own if it is flat, sharp, or good. The candidate can defend where he put the note. The other two examiners must agree it is flat, or that it is sharp, and agree with the computer program correctly or the deduction is thrown out.
> 
>       So notes that are outside parameters, but are "pleasing" , balancing intervals well, can and are often thrown out. Bad notes are verified aurally in a blind test. Pleasing notes can brown out, and not become deductions.
> 
>      Smart test. Good exercise.
>      Bad notes are proven in this blind aural testing for "pleasing balanced intervals"
> 
>                                               Dave Renaud
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 2012-05-12, at 3:26 PM, "David Love" <davidlovepianos at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > Except that the exam is not scored on "pleasing". It is scored on objective criteria the foundations of which are laid down electronically. If pleasing were the criteria for passing the exam then we would expect to see no deductions for musical sounding well temperaments or octave stretching which exceeds the exam protocols which many will say are much more conservative than they use in real life.
> > ------Original Message------
> > From: Mark Dierauf
> > Sender: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org
> > To: pianotech at ptg.org
> > ReplyTo: pianotech at ptg.org
> > Subject: Re: [pianotech] CTE's - what are you thoughts? (continuation of Re: Old can of worms)
> > Sent: May 12, 2012 11:41 AM
> >
> > Bingo! What he said!
> >
> > - Mark
> >
> > On 5/12/2012 11:19 AM, Kent Swafford wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> Pianos are tuned for the benefit of music, an aural art. Regardless of
> >> the methods used to accomplish a finely tuned piano, the results are,
> >> in the end, expected to be _aurally_ pleasing. Perhaps the current
> >> exam reflects that simple fact.
> >>
> >>
> >> Kent
> >
> >
> >
> > David Love
> > www.davidlovepianos.com
> > (sent from bb)
> 

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