[pianotech] Wiping Rusty Strings W/Oil

[Michael Magness]

On Tue, Sep 28, 2010 at 10:17 PM, Tom Driscoll <tomtuner at verizon.net> wrote:

>  Michael,
>    I use protek on every pitch raise but never with a spray bottle. I run a
> quick thin stream with a needle oiler over the presssure and  v-bar and
> anywhere else that excessive friction exists. I'm guessing that I perform a
> similar amount of pitch raises and was taught to pull them up as fast as
> possible with the Coleman-Defebaugh anticipated drop method and also rarely
> break strings.
>
> You wrote :   " pulling wire through that point rapidly during a major
> pitch correction, is IMHO a recipe for breaking strings."
>
> .From 30 + years experience I'll respectfully disagree that the speed at
> which the wire bends around the pin will increase the likelihood of string
>  breakage .
>  For discussions sake let's say  your premise is correct and my method does
> increase the frequency of string breakage.  Add up the total time spent on
> 6 to 8  slow pull pitch raises vs. the jerk it on up method and that time
> differential  more than offsets the rare broken string.
>
> Also you wrote : "I pulled that piano to pitch first sitting, with no
> string breakage "
>
>
> With no overshoot from 179 cents flat I suspect the pitch after 80 minutes
> was at least 20 cents low . Did you slow pull again to 440 or fine tune at
> that point?
>
> The Coleman anticipated drop method and my accutuner pitch raise program
> leaves the piano around pitch but very  rough. One more very quick pass and
> I'm raising some strings , lowering some others and  end up   with a piano
> that is essentially at pitch with rough unisons.Total time 30 to 45 minutes
> tops.
> Routine tuning follows.
>  Just my take on this . The great thing about our trade is the diversity of
> technique and opinion .Even Phil Bondi has a valid opinion once in a
> while.<G> Love Ya Phillip!
> Best wishes,
> Tom Driscoll
>
>
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Michael Magness <ifixpiano at gmail.com>
> *To:* Pianotech List <pianotech at ptg.org>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 28, 2010 6:31 PM
> *Subject:* [pianotech] Wiping Rusty Strings W/Oil
>
>
> I have rarely had the problem of strings breaking, rusty or not when I tune
> with care.
> I frequently read on this venue of those who "pulled it to pitch with a
> quick pass" , I don't do that even on new pianos.
>
> Some of you may remember me writing of a 179c pitch raise, using my
> Cybertuner, I pulled that piano to pitch first sitting, with no string
> breakage. It had some string rust & I did use Protek on the V-Bar via a
> Q-tip however I also took my time pulling it to pitch, it took about 80
> minutes.
> Strings frequently break at the pin where they begin the turn around the
> pin, a stress point, pulling wire through that point rapidly during a major
> pitch correction, is IMHO a recipe for breaking strings.
>
> I probably do at least 6 to 8 1/2 tone or more, pitch raises a month. I do
> the disclaimer at each one that it's possible that strings will break, they
> rarely do with the exception of the cheap pianos where one expects it.
>
> I have used Protek perhaps one or 2 other times as I did on that 179c PR. I
> bought a 4oz. spray bottle & an 8oz. refill & still have both 8 years later.
>
> I did tune a piano for a while that had the tuning pins "cleaned" with
> WD-40. Initially the pins were nice & tight, with in 2 years they wouldn't
> hold anymore as the WD-40 had migrated fully into the block.
>
> Mike
> --
>
>
> Michael Magness
>
>

Tom,

I find Protek to be useful in certain circumstances but IMHO it's use
frequently far outweighs any necessity for it. Judgment should be used
rather than Protek.

I'm glad you have been that lucky pulling strings to pitch that quickly, I
wasn't taught that way & it has stood me in good stead for over 41 years.
When you figure up the difference for time saved yanking pianos to pitch &
the strings broken don't forget the callbacks to touchup those new strings.

My Cybertuner anticipates pitch drop but even so the piano(an old upright
nearly 100 years old) did drop over 30c. My method has always been to tune
pianos to pitch over a period of time, not attempt to return them to A440 in
one sitting, after they have been allowed over a 5, 10 or 20 year period to
go 1/2 tone or more flat.
Attempting to fine tune a piano that was 1/2 tone flat in one sitting is &
always will be folly IMHO.

It may sound on pitch when you leave but trust me, 3 to 6 weeks later it
won't resemble a piano that was tuned.

 I have spent 41 years tuning both aurally & the last 2+ using a Cybertuner,
I still do 1/2 tone pitch raises in 2 sittings seperated by a 2-3 week
period. I get a much more satisfactory result than attempting to undo the
neglect of the customer in an hour or hour & a half.

I also acquire several customers a year from other tuners & techs who have
done the "one sitting" method.

When I started in this business I was taught to do pitch raises as I do them
now, others have attempted to sway me to the single sitting method.
I note that as a rebuilder & when I tune new pianos, I tune them more often
due to the new strings stretching, bending into place, etc. A piano that
hasn't been tuned for several years has the same problems & should be
treated somewhat the same. It has developed bends in the wire where they
shouldn't be, some of those bends will move into the speaking length & will
straighten out, not in an hour but over a few weeks. During that same few
weeks the new bends will tighten around the bends & then the piano is ready
for a fine tune, again IMHO.

Mike

-- 

It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without
accepting it.

    Aristotle (384 BC - 322 BC)

Michael Magness
Magness Piano Service
608-786-4404
www.IFixPianos.com
email mike at ifixpianos.com
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