At the last Convention Rchard Kingsbury,RPT, from Wisconsin,showed me his new 'toy',a modified dental tool to remove-scrape away hardened Jack Regulating Button Felt while the whippen is still in action..It makes diagnostic procedure much easier.... isaac On Oct 4, 2009, at 11:31 AM, Dave Davis wrote: > Paul, > > I agree with the comments about knuckles and back rail cloth often > being the culprit for action noise, but most often on Young Chang > pianos, it is the jack regulating button, as Ed Sutton mentioned. > This is a noise problem that is especially specific to older YC > pianos. If it sounds like a typewriter, it's the reg button felt. > > Best regards, > > Dave Davis, RPT > > > From: Paul Milesi <paul at pmpiano.com> > Date: Sun, 04 Oct 2009 13:27:00 -0400 > To: PTG Pianotech List<pianotech at ptg.org> > Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: ActionClicking/ > KnockingUpon Quick Key Release > > I agree that the back rail felt did seem rather hard/dense when I > tested the keys. But that’s not what I’m hearing, because, as > stated in my original description of the problem, I hear it even > when the key is only partially release, i.e., the back of the key > isn’t even touching the back rail cloth. I believe Ed Sutton in the > CAUT list hit the nail on the head, confirming my own suspicion, > that it is the jack regulating buttons that are too hard. -Paul > -- > Paul Milesi > Registered Piano Technician (RPT) > Piano Technicians Guild > (202) 667-3136 > (202) 246-3136 Cell > E-mail: paul at pmpiano.com > Website: http://www.pmpiano.com > > Address: > 3000 7th Street NE, Apt. 204 > Washington, DC 20017-1402 > > > From: William Truitt <surfdog at metrocast.net> > Reply-To: <pianotech at ptg.org> > Date: Sun, 4 Oct 2009 13:04:33 -0400 > To: <pianotech at ptg.org> > Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: ActionClicking/ > KnockingUpon Quick Key Release > > I’m with Joe Goss on this one. The back rails on these pianos can > tend to be noisy, because the keybeds themselves can resonate more > that the average bear. So anything you can do in the way of non- > compacted back rail felt is a plus. > > Will Truitt > > > > From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] > On Behalf Of Joe Goss > Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 12:17 PM > To: pianotech at ptg.org > Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: ActionClicking/ > KnockingUpon Quick Key Release > > > Hi, > > Have you checked the back rail cloth and the way it is glued down? > > Joe Goss BSMusEd MMusEd RPT > imatunr at srvinet.com > www.mothergoosetools.com <http://www.mothergoosetools.com> > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Tom Driscoll <mailto:tomtuner at verizon.net> > > To: pmc033 at earthlink.net ; pianotech at ptg.org > > Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 8:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: ActionClicking/ > KnockingUpon Quick Key Release > > > > Paul, > > Ditto to the comments so far. I had a client just yesterday with a > Samick-10 year old grand. Same symptom. This time it was not the > returning jack punching which I have found to be a culprit over the > years.Sometimes worn -over eased balance rail holes can contribute > to noisy return, but not the case with this Samick. > > I needled a sample knuckle with some improvement (After tightening > screws of course) Removed a whippen and needled the whip cushion on > the same note . > > noise was diminished but to my beginning pianist client even with > improvement the piano is considered unplayable. She has decided to > practice on a Yamaha GH1 that was part of her new home purchase > because it does not make this noise. It does however sound like a > banjo that has been outside for two years. > > I digress here, but I was called to tune both with her intent to > sell the Samick (In this case superior to the GH1 in every way) > because it had a small chip in one keytop. I explained about the > tone-tuning instability of the GH1 and suggested that the GH1 would > be the piano to sell and lets not tune it until the weather > changes.Here in New England the tenor on these will go 30 cents > wild when a cloud passes overhead. > > I think she considers the Yamaha to be the better piano because the > teacher likes it and I can't completely cure the noise in the > Samick. (the teacher is a very nice and has me tune her upright > every 10 years--No kidding) > > A day in the life. > > Tom Driscoll > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: pmc033 at earthlink.net > > To: pianotech at ptg.org > > Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 8:37 AM > > Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: ActionClicking/ > KnockingUpon Quick Key Release > > > > Hi, Paul: > > I agree with Tom about the knuckles, but you might also look at > the jack rest cushions. They get compacted and become noisy. In > some of these, I had to needle them with a chopstick voicing tool. > Once I actually had to replace them with (yikes!) butt felt > squares. You can see if the problem is those rest felts by flicking > the jack tips. If they make that sound, you found your culprit. > The sound will reverberate with the help of the aluminum rail. > > Have fun. > > Paul McCloud > > San Diego > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Paul Milesi <mailto:paul at pmpiano.com> > > To: PTG Pianotech List <mailto:pianotech at ptg.org> > > Sent: 10/04/2009 1:07:53 AM > > Subject: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: Action Clicking/ > KnockingUpon Quick Key Release > > > I am now responsible for servicing three 1997 Weber grands at Howard > U, ranging in size from the 4’11” WG-50 to WG-57 (5’7”) and WG-60 > (6’1”). These three are now in pretty good shape overall, but need > regulation. There are others on campus I haven’t seen yet, but have > heard they’re in bad shape. > > Tonight I went to a hotel which is a private client of mine and re- > visited a 5’2” Young Chang G-157 for the first time in quite a long > while. I was struck by the similarities -- same problems I’m having > with the Webers, which my research had told me were made by Young > Chang in Inchon, South Korea. > > All these pianos have a “noisy” action! At first I thought it might > be worn key bushings or loose wippen or hammer flange screws. But > I’ve now taken the time to eliminate the key and the flanges. The > noise appears to be either (1) the repetition or jack hitting the > knuckle; or (2) the jack regulating button hitting the stop. The > knocking/clicking occurs when any key is released quickly, but not > even necessarily all the way up. I believe it happens when the key > is released enough to let the jack return. I’m now wondering if a > third possibility is the spring in the little hole of the jack? If > so, what’s the fix? > > Please, this is driving me crazy! As a pianist and technician, I > want to understand what’s happening here, and this is frustrating > me. I believe these pianos can be regulated to make them a lot > better, satisfactory practice instruments, but before I waste a lot > of time, I’m wondering if this problem is somehow endemic to these > instruments? Can this noise on every key be alleviated? Does it > have anything to do with aluminum rails? HELP! > > Thanks, > Paul > -- > Paul Milesi > Registered Piano Technician (RPT) > Piano Technicians Guild > (202 ) 667-3136 > (202) 246-3136 Cell > E-mail: paul at pmpiano.com > Website: http://www.pmpiano.com > > Address: > 3000 7th Street NE, Apt. 204 > Washington, DC 20017-1402 > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.420 / Virus Database: 270.14.3/2412 - Release Date: > 10/03/09 18:34:00 > > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.420 / Virus Database: 270.14.3/2413 - Release Date: > 10/04/09 06:20:00 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://ptg.org/pipermail/pianotech.php/attachments/20091004/5a9b40b8/attachment.htm>
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