Paul, I agree with the comments about knuckles and back rail cloth often being the culprit for action noise, but most often on Young Chang pianos, it is the jack regulating button, as Ed Sutton mentioned. This is a noise problem that is especially specific to older YC pianos. If it sounds like a typewriter, it's the reg button felt. Best regards, Dave Davis, RPT -----Original Message----- From: Paul Milesi <paul at pmpiano.com> Date: Sun, 04 Oct 2009 13:27:00 To: PTG Pianotech List<pianotech at ptg.org> Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: ActionClicking/KnockingUpon Quick Key Release I agree that the back rail felt did seem rather hard/dense when I tested the keys. But that¹s not what I¹m hearing, because, as stated in my original description of the problem, I hear it even when the key is only partially release, i.e., the back of the key isn¹t even touching the back rail cloth. I believe Ed Sutton in the CAUT list hit the nail on the head, confirming my own suspicion, that it is the jack regulating buttons that are too hard. -Paul -- Paul Milesi Registered Piano Technician (RPT) Piano Technicians Guild (202) 667-3136 (202) 246-3136 Cell E-mail: paul at pmpiano.com Website: http://www.pmpiano.com Address: 3000 7th Street NE, Apt. 204 Washington, DC 20017-1402 From: William Truitt <surfdog at metrocast.net> Reply-To: <pianotech at ptg.org> Date: Sun, 4 Oct 2009 13:04:33 -0400 To: <pianotech at ptg.org> Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: ActionClicking/KnockingUpon Quick Key Release I¹m with Joe Goss on this one. The back rails on these pianos can tend to be noisy, because the keybeds themselves can resonate more that the average bear. So anything you can do in the way of non-compacted back rail felt is a plus. Will Truitt From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of Joe Goss Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 12:17 PM To: pianotech at ptg.org Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: ActionClicking/KnockingUpon Quick Key Release Hi, Have you checked the back rail cloth and the way it is glued down? Joe Goss BSMusEd MMusEd RPT imatunr at srvinet.com www.mothergoosetools.com <http://www.mothergoosetools.com> > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Tom Driscoll <mailto:tomtuner at verizon.net> > > To: pmc033 at earthlink.net ; pianotech at ptg.org > > Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 8:56 AM > > Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: > ActionClicking/KnockingUpon Quick Key Release > > > > Paul, > > Ditto to the comments so far. I had a client just yesterday with a Samick-10 > year old grand. Same symptom. This time it was not the returning jack > punching which I have found to be a culprit over the years.Sometimes worn > -over eased balance rail holes can contribute to noisy return, but not the > case with this Samick. > > I needled a sample knuckle with some improvement (After tightening screws of > course) Removed a whippen and needled the whip cushion on the same note . > > noise was diminished but to my beginning pianist client even with improvement > the piano is considered unplayable. She has decided to practice on a Yamaha > GH1 that was part of her new home purchase because it does not make this > noise. It does however sound like a banjo that has been outside for two > years. > > I digress here, but I was called to tune both with her intent to sell the > Samick (In this case superior to the GH1 in every way) because it had a small > chip in one keytop. I explained about the tone-tuning instability of the GH1 > and suggested that the GH1 would be the piano to sell and lets not tune it > until the weather changes.Here in New England the tenor on these will go 30 > cents wild when a cloud passes overhead. > > I think she considers the Yamaha to be the better piano because the teacher > likes it and I can't completely cure the noise in the Samick. (the teacher is > a very nice and has me tune her upright every 10 years--No kidding) > > A day in the life. > > Tom Driscoll > > > > >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> >> From: pmc033 at earthlink.net >> >> To: pianotech at ptg.org >> >> Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 8:37 AM >> >> Subject: Re: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: >> ActionClicking/KnockingUpon Quick Key Release >> >> >> >> Hi, Paul: >> >> I agree with Tom about the knuckles, but you might also look at the jack >> rest cushions. They get compacted and become noisy. In some of these, I had >> to needle them with a chopstick voicing tool. Once I actually had to replace >> them with (yikes!) butt felt squares. You can see if the problem is those >> rest felts by flicking the jack tips. If they make that sound, you found >> your culprit. The sound will reverberate with the help of the aluminum rail. >> >> Have fun. >> >> Paul McCloud >> >> San Diego >> >> >> >> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >>> From: Paul Milesi <mailto:paul at pmpiano.com> >>> >>> To: PTG Pianotech List <mailto:pianotech at ptg.org> >>> >>> Sent: 10/04/2009 1:07:53 AM >>> >>> Subject: [pianotech] Young Chang & Weber Grands: Action >>> Clicking/KnockingUpon Quick Key Release >>> >>> >>> I am now responsible for servicing three 1997 Weber grands at Howard U, >>> ranging in size from the 4¹11² WG-50 to WG-57 (5¹7²) and WG-60 (6¹1²). >>> These three are now in pretty good shape overall, but need regulation. >>> There are others on campus I haven¹t seen yet, but have heard they¹re in bad >>> shape. >>> >>> Tonight I went to a hotel which is a private client of mine and re-visited a >>> 5¹2² Young Chang G-157 for the first time in quite a long while. I was >>> struck by the similarities -- same problems I¹m having with the Webers, >>> which my research had told me were made by Young Chang in Inchon, South >>> Korea. >>> >>> All these pianos have a ³noisy² action! At first I thought it might be worn >>> key bushings or loose wippen or hammer flange screws. But I¹ve now taken >>> the time to eliminate the key and the flanges. The noise appears to be >>> either (1) the repetition or jack hitting the knuckle; or (2) the jack >>> regulating button hitting the stop. The knocking/clicking occurs when any >>> key is released quickly, but not even necessarily all the way up. I believe >>> it happens when the key is released enough to let the jack return. I¹m now >>> wondering if a third possibility is the spring in the little hole of the >>> jack? If so, what¹s the fix? >>> >>> Please, this is driving me crazy! As a pianist and technician, I want to >>> understand what¹s happening here, and this is frustrating me. I believe >>> these pianos can be regulated to make them a lot better, satisfactory >>> practice instruments, but before I waste a lot of time, I¹m wondering if >>> this problem is somehow endemic to these instruments? Can this noise on >>> every key be alleviated? Does it have anything to do with aluminum rails? >>> HELP! >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Paul >>> -- >>> Paul Milesi >>> Registered Piano Technician (RPT) >>> Piano Technicians Guild >>> (202 ) 667-3136 >>> (202) 246-3136 Cell >>> E-mail: paul at pmpiano.com >>> Website: http://www.pmpiano.com >>> >>> Address: >>> 3000 7th Street NE, Apt. 204 >>> Washington, DC 20017-1402 >> >> >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 8.5.420 / Virus Database: 270.14.3/2412 - Release Date: 10/03/09 >> 18:34:00 > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.420 / Virus Database: 270.14.3/2413 - Release Date: 10/04/09 > 06:20:00 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://ptg.org/pipermail/pianotech.php/attachments/20091004/ec145cf8/attachment-0001.htm>
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