[pianotech] PR fight!

[James Grebe]

Maybe in California you could do that, but not in St. Louis where we have 
real swings in temp and humidity.  As I see it when tension is increased 
dramatically the sound board gets compressed at the crown and it kind of 
retreats and over a few days bounces back a little.  Also, even with 
pounding, the segments outside the speaking length are going to move over 
several days.   I have used an SAT since the 1980's and it does not matter 
how close your final tuning is, it is going to move if the piano has been 
low for years.  My regimen on anything over 25c is today, 2 weeks, and 
recommend in 3 months followed by every 6.  The further over 25c the more 
this is true for me.  I guess it is hard to believe that in stable climates 
this is not needed but it certainly is here.
James
James Grebe Est. 1962
Piano Tuner-Technician
Creator of Custom Caster Cups
Creator of fine Writing Instruments
www.grebepiano.com
1526 Raspberry Lane
Arnold, MO 63010
(314) 608-4137
Become what you believe
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Blaine Hebert" <brhebert at verizon.net>
To: <pianotech at ptg.org>
Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 12:11 AM
Subject: [pianotech] PR fight!


> Subject: Pitch Raise Fight!
>
> Wim talked me into adding my $0.02:
>
> I understand that this issue is painfully close to the heart of every 
> piano tech, because of all of our struggles with our pianos, our customers 
> and our own inadequacies, so perhaps this is an unwinable argument.
>
> Before my ETD it took me 4 to 6 passes to get close to pitch across the 
> keyboard on major pitch raises, I eventually learned not to sweat slight 
> inaccuracies of pitch (439.6 or 440.2 was perfectly fine, unless for a 
> concert or studio session).  My Cybertuner now lets me get frighteningly 
> close to pitch after the first pass, and after 36 years of tuning I can't 
> come close to that accuracy (though occasionally I can gratifyingly hit it 
> on the nose) and after two ETD passes the piano is usually quite adequate 
> for most students.  Another pass with the machine turned off and the piano 
> teacher can come over and check it out.
>
> If you are changing the pitch at all, anywhere on the scale on your last 
> fine tuning pass then your tuning will not be stable.  "You cannot tune 
> and out of tune piano" (I wish I could remember who first said that).  If 
> you have a fairly even tuning before the last pass then you can rely on 
> your tuning to hold for 6 months to a year (I am in Southern California 
> where tunings can hold well for TWO years; I just did one).  I  only seen 
> a slight difference between my major pitch raise's stability and a careful 
> tuning a year later.
>
> The Cybertuner folks say that all of the pitch change is due to soundboard 
> effects and their claim is supported by their quite mathematical research, 
> which is hard to refute.  The recent suggestion (on pianotech) that there 
> is a similar pitch change effect from pianos with low string bearing makes 
> me wonder a bit,  I haven't broached the subject with Carl Liberman or 
> Dean Reyburn. I have always believed that the plate and back flexed, but 
> no one has shown me evidence that the "rebound effect" is anything other 
> than soundboard changes.
>
> If I needed to retune a piano after two weeks I would do it free of 
> charge.
>
> Blaine Hebert
> www.HebertPiano.com