Tuning sequence question

[Gene Nelson]

Recently helped prep a SSD for an RPT exam and the amount that the bass was designated to be detuned to the sharp side broke a string. These were not more than 2 year old strings. It is much more likely that a wound bass string will be closer to the brake point than plain steel.
When I use a SAT for pitch raise I start on the lowest plain steel tenor note and overpull by the 25% margin - unisons as I go and re-adjust the overpull every major third. Then 35% in the treble. After that I octave tune the bass. 
Regardless of what kind of pinao, or size this works very well all the time. The overpull on the bass is minimal  and usually nothing as everything has just about settled to pitch at this point.
When I fine tune I always start either in the temperament and go to lowest plain steel tenor note then to the top if ear tuning or at the lowest tenor note and go to the top using SAT. Bass is always last either way. My tunings have become much more stable using this technique and I  no longer need to overpull the bass. 
This has worked on pitch raises from up to 140 cents flat as well.
Gene
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Andrew and Rebeca Anderson 
  To: Pianotech List 
  Sent: Monday, July 09, 2007 7:19 PM
  Subject: Re: Tuning sequence question


  Gene,
  I do use a Verituner VT100 so I can watch what is going on.  On a concert grand I overpull as much as 18% of the amount the strings were flat..  On a little spinet as little as 8%.  No overpull means I will have to pull up again on the second pass.  I personally prefer settling down a little over trying to pull up a little.

  Andrew Anderson

  At 07:49 PM 7/9/2007, you wrote:

    I do not like to overpull the bass on a pitch raise. It is usually not necessary and overpulling wound strings can be more risky for breaking than plain strings as they can be much closer to the break point.
    Gene Nelson

      ----- Original Message ----- 

      From: Shawn Brock 

      To: Pianotech List 

      Sent: Thursday, January 01, 2004 7:01 PM

      Subject: Re: Tuning sequence question


      Jeff,

      that's how I do it.  When I use a strip I tune the middle of the piano and pull the strip out to tune the unisons.  Its my belief that stripping the hole piano, or damn near the hole piano makes for an unstable tuning in the end.  When possible I prefer to use just one wedge mute.  Through experiment I have found the tuning is more stable with this process.  When tuning just one string and bringing two others in after going through most of the piano I have found that a lot of times the temperament goes a little wild.  Its not a question of tuning hammer technique on my part because for some reason I have been blessed with good stability when being tested.  It Any how...  Just my thoughts.  When using the strip I always tune the temperament and middle of the piano and the unisons next.  I know some tuners who just strip the temperament and nothing else.  Hope this helps.

        ----- Original Message ----- 

        From: Geoff Sykes 

        To: 'Pianotech List' 

        Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2007 5:05 PM

        Subject: Tuning sequence question


        Greetings all --



        I know that when using an ETD the preferred method of tuning is from the bass up to the treble, tuning unisons as you go. Tests have apparently proven that this provides a more accurate and stable tuning when completed. 



        Traditionally, aural tuning means strip muting the entire piano, and after setting the temperament, all the center strings are then tuned moving first down into the bass and then up into the treble. After the center strings are tuned then unisons are set starting in the bass and moving up through the treble. 



        In doing an aural tuning, is there any reason why one could not, or perhaps should not, strip mute just the middle section of the piano, in order to set the temperament, then immediately set the unisons in the temperament, pulling out the strip mute as you go, followed by moving down into the bass tuning the first string and setting unisons as you go and subsequently up through the treble? 



        In other words, which aural tuning method of the two described above, would produce the more accurate and stable tuning when completed?



        -- Geoff Sykes

        -- Los Angeles


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