New one. David I. ----- Original message ---------------------------------------- From: antares <antares@euronet.nl> To: THE LIST <pianotech@ptg.org> Received: Tue, 18 Jan 2005 21:03:55 +0100 Subject: soundboards >I have posed this question before : >If you had the choice : you can get a brand new Steinway D and you can >get a hundred year old Steinway D... >What would be your choice? >André Oorebeek >Hi Stephane > I enjoy this post & your thoughtfulness to the subject. Just a >couple Of comments interspersed below > >Stephane writes >A soundboard is a filter (even a resonant one). No way all the energy >of the string will ever end up in acoustic energy, nor will the >ineluctable losses ever be even through the scale. And that is great. >A soundboard has a personality that comes from what one would describe >as defects in regard of the basis parameters. I would describe the >personality of a board as the unique blend it features between many >more parameters, such as subtle and aesthetically more or less >interesting discrepancies curves in volume, sustain and evenness across >the scale of each of the partials of each note, their thump, and the >resonance's in release phase. >Unfortunately (ah, maybe not), this is much less easy to have under >control, and leads us to humility in front of the miracle of nature, as >there exist some blends that make you believe in god, while others, uh, >not really. >....>>>>> I agree in a way, that even with some tonal defects many older >boards have a charming musical quality about them, But When the defects >become to great however, which, is usually in the 5th & 6th and then >into the 4th octaves the quality of musical expression diminishes & >that's when my ears get disinterested. Disinterest because of loss of >sustain in the melody range which is replaced with the >insidious thwacking percussive sound I can't voice out nor tolerate in >music. > >This being said, my opinion about old soundboards is that they have >gathered with time (cell crush, down in resine percentage, loss of >elasticity, whatever) a stronger and more unique personality, as >defined here. > > I Assume you mean more personality than a new board. > I think humbly, this conclusion is really subjective. If you mean a >stronger or more unique personality to that of a new rib crowned or >redesigned board system then I would ask if you've had opportunity to >hear one of the boards( & personalities thereof) that many of us are >producing in private shops here in the U.S. > From the point of view of a winemaker he has had opportunity to taste >good old wines & newer wines compare the two or many. He has a >different experience & exposure to many more expereinces than the >casual wine drinker who, may think that two buck chuck ( cheap wine >here) is a fine delicacsy. > All this to say Many wonderful soundboard tones & personality comes >in many forms & flavors & many of those are new one off boards produced >in small shops. > Ask Dave Andersen about new versus old. He didn't know if new could >match or equal a really fine old board that had retained many of it's >magic properties. And now.................... > > The whole life of a soundboard contributes to it's unique sound. This >doesn't mean that all personalities please me. But the personalities >who do are not at all the most powerful and long lasting and most even >across scale of every parameter ones. > The fact is that crown ,bearing & tone have a life span. My expereince >here in the U.S. is that many techs, dealers & general public simply >want to give some unrealistic mystique & expectaion to a board that has >out lived it's life, performed well, but thru time lost it's vitality. >The result of this & I see it ALL the time is that pianos that are >"rebuilt" or rebuilt and sold under some B.S. notion that it has the >original board & that old is superior is disengenuos & ignorant at >best & false advertising or fraud at worst. > Many Folks are getting ripped off. It's very easy as a tech to fall >into the trap of giving an estimate of repair with the over optimistic >idea that the old ,flat,cracked to smithereens board will somehow come >to life if certain incantations are performed over it or magic varnish >is applied. > Know how I know??? Cause long ago I used to be there & was >disappointed & my sleep suffered. > > > >Same for old boards, in my opinion. When I hear an old piano in need >of restoration, I always take the time to tune it, and I can then hear, >even with worn hammers, loss of crown etc. if the board has a >personality (that is, thus, a blend of so called defects) that makes me >want to give it it's chance to appear in full monthly. If I don't feel >it has potential, I don't buy it. > Your ears are probably really good & you can hear it, meaning defects >and loss of crown & tonal vitality.. For me I just had to get honest & >put myself in the place of the poor trusting client and ask. Would I >wanto to pay for the product I was producing. After restoring >everything else would I compromise the very soul of the instrument. > The answer became a resounding NO!! > >Newer boards may or may not have personality. In my world, they are >like 1m75 blondes with B2 breasts and sinusoidal shape at hips with 65 >kg weight and red lipstick. Why do I prefer redheads with the nose >slightly bent to the left a tiny bit overweight and with intelligence >in the look ? > May I suggest Stephane, that it's possible the new boards you are >hearing probably do look like the blondes you describe. A good rib >crowned new board however has a lot of personality & probably resembles >your taste in redheads. Yeah Baby!!!!!! > Friendly greetings back your way > Dale > >Friendly greetings, > >Stéphane Collin. > > >friendly greetings >from >André Oorebeek >Vita Dura Est >_______________________________________________ >pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
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