Based on various encounters and comments in Sydney
last year, I had a chance to play on the Stuart
concert grand at the University of New South Wales in
Sydney, Australia when i was doing my degree at the
Conservatory of music there (they had one of Ron O's
pianos that i missed :(
I'd confidently say its a dream to play
on....BEETHOVEN and mozart especially....but a
Bach-Busoni and Rachmaninoff ended up with me pushing
the piano into overdrive because there was that
certain lack of overtones that the Steinway has become
so famous for...in short, imho, the Stuart is very
singing..it's like a voice that never runs out of
breath...the 4th pedal is a boon to use, although i
ended up pressing the 4th pedal in mistake with the
una corda shift one....
I think the bulk of repertoire in Sydney is usually of
the classical period...this based on my observation of
the Sydney Symphony (they have alot of beethoven and
mozart piano concerto cycles).. therefore this piano
was specially engineered for that purpose...
I had a friend who concertised on the Stuart piano as
well...playing a killer Liszt/Rachmaninoff/Medtner
repertoire....and he did pass a personal comment that
altho the touch was pleasantly light, there was not
enough depth to suit the demands of virtruoso playing.
Amery
--- pianotech-request@ptg.org wrote:
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> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it
> is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of pianotech digest..."
> > Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@ up?
> (Ron Nossaman)
> 2. Noise/"Deaf Tuners"/Susan (Joseph Garrett)
> 3. Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@ up?
> (DIANE HOFSTETTER)
> 4. Re: no biz
> 5. Paging "w peterson" (Hechler Family)
> 6. Glue cleanup on ribs
> 7. Chickering concert grand serial numbers (Jay
> Mercier)
> 8. Re: Stuart Piano (Mark Bolsius)
> 9. RE: Glue cleanup on ribs (David Love)
> 10. Re: Chickering concert grand serial numbers
> (Robin Hufford)
> 11. Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@ up?
> 12. Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@ up?
> (Keith McGavern)
> 13. Re: Noise/"Deaf Tuners"/Susan (Susan Kline)
> 14. Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@ up?
> (Susan Kline)
> 15. life of a piano tuner
> 16. Re: life of a piano tuner (Clyde Hollinger)
> 17. Re: String vibrations (Phillip Ford)
> 18. Re: String vibrations (Phillip Ford)
> 19. Re: Glue cleanup on ribs (Farrell)
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.1 message/rfc822
> Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 18:41:39 -0500
> From: Ron Nossaman <RNossaman@cox.net>
> To: davidlovepianos@earthlink.net, Pianotech
> <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@
> up?
>
>
> With kids, I try "You guys are wiping me out over
> here, could you" - insert
> noise reduction request - "so I can hear to finish
> up? That's great,
> thanks." Most often works just fine.
>
> With adults, it's "You guys are wiping me
> out....etc." I sometimes offer to
> have them come sit and listen, promising not to
> laugh at them when they
> fall asleep and snore with their mouth open. Almost
> anything can work
> inoffensively if the delivery is right and you give
> the impression of one
> person communicating with another. One of my
> favorites is tuning louder and
> louder as they shout louder and louder to hear
> themselves over my noise,
> then stop suddenly, hands down, turn, and grin at
> them. "Oh, gee. I bet
> we're bothering you aren't we?" Keep grinning and
> nod. People just don't
> have the remotest clue that piano tuners are mortal
> beings that must be
> kept from freezing or roasting, isolated from lethal
> gasses and
> insecticides, killer dogs, and noise levels that
> cause metal fatigue. They
> need our help to realize these things.
>
> Tuning a piano this afternoon at the Art Museum,
> three people wandered in
> and stood about ten feet behind me laughing,
> talking, making exploding
> noises, and such. I tuned louder. They shouted
> louder. I hoped the need for
> added volume on their part would necessitate more
> expansive gesticulation
> and maybe someone would dislocate a shoulder and
> wander off for medical
> attention. Didn't work. Tuned louder. They shouted
> louder, still uninjured.
> I stopped and turned to the guy who was up on the
> stage quietly installing
> a large decorative backdrop next to me and asked "Do
> you know the
> definition of a conversation pit?" "No, what?", he
> asked. "Anywhere a piano
> is being tuned", I answered, then continued tuning
> at a more normal volume
> level. No more conversation pit, and I got within a
> half dozen unisons of
> finishing before one of the conversationalists found
> his way to the audio
> console and cranked up the sound check. I almost got
> away with it.
> Ron N
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.2 message/rfc822
> Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 16:56:16 -0700
> From: "Joseph Garrett" <joegarrett@earthlink.net>
> To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Noise/"Deaf Tuners"/Susan
>
> Susan said: "P.S. If one has hearing loss, then of
> course one _needs_ more
> quiet
> conditions. Just how to ask for complete quiet
> without making them think
> they've hired a deaf tuner -- well, I hope I never
> have to deal with that
> myself, but I sympathize."
>
> Susan,
> Your concept of hearing loss is wrong! If you want
> to know why/how, we'll
> discuss it privately.
> Regards,
> Joe Garrett, RPT, (Oregon)
> Captain, Tool Police
> Squares Are I
>
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.3 message/rfc822
> Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 16:43:52 -0800
> From: "DIANE HOFSTETTER" <dianepianotuner@msn.com>
> To: pianotech@ptg.org
> Subject: Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@
> up?
>
>
>
> I've often suspected that they wish WE would shut
> the ........up. For most
> people, listening to a piano being tuned is just
> another annoying noise in
> their lives. And so they subconsciously try to get
> all their other noisy
> chores done at the same time, hoping for peace and
> quiet for
> themselves---later.
>
> So it really is necessary to educate them.
> Sometimes showing them how to
> hear beats does wonders.
>
> Diane Hofstettter
>
>
>
> >From: Ron Nossaman Reply-To: Pianotech To:
> davidlovepianos@earthlink.net,
> >Pianotech Subject: Re: How do you get them to shut
> the #%$@ up? Date: Sat,
> >20 Sep 2003 18:41:39 -0500
> >
> >
> >With kids, I try "You guys are wiping me out over
> here, could you" - insert
> >noise reduction request - "so I can hear to finish
> up? That's great,
> >thanks." Most often works just fine.
> >
> >With adults, it's "You guys are wiping me
> out....etc." I sometimes offer to
> >have them come sit and listen, promising not to
> laugh at them when they
> >fall asleep and snore with their mouth open. Almost
> anything can work
> >inoffensively if the delivery is right and you give
> the impression of one
> >person communicating with another. One of my
> favorites is tuning louder and
> >louder as they shout louder and louder to hear
> themselves over my noise,
> >then stop suddenly, hands down, turn, and grin at
> them. "Oh, gee. I bet
> >we're bothering you aren't we?" Keep grinning and
> nod. People just don't
> >have the remotest clue that piano tuners are mortal
> beings that must be
> >kept from freezing or roasting, isolated from
> lethal gasses and
> >insecticides, killer dogs, and noise levels that
> cause metal fatigue. They
> >need our help to realize these things.
> >
> >Tuning a piano this afternoon at the Art Museum,
> three people wandered in
> >and stood about ten feet behind me laughing,
> talking, making exploding
> >noises, and such. I tuned louder. They shouted
> louder. I hoped the need for
> >added volume on their part would necessitate more
> expansive gesticulation
> >and maybe someone would dislocate a shoulder and
> wander off for medical
> >attention. Didn't work. Tuned louder. They shouted
> louder, still uninjured.
> >I stopped and turned to the guy who was up on the
> stage quietly installing
> >a large decorative backdrop next to me and asked
> "Do you know the
> >definition of a conversation pit?" "No, what?", he
> asked. "Anywhere a piano
> >is being tuned", I answered, then continued tuning
> at a more normal volume
> >level. No more conversation pit, and I got within a
> half dozen unisons of
> >finishing before one of the conversationalists
> found his way to the audio
> >console and cranked up the sound check. I almost
> got away with it. Ron N
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> pianotech list info:
> >https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
> Instant message during games with MSN Messenger 6.0.
> Download it now FREE!
> http://msnmessenger-download.com
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.4 message/rfc822
> Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 21:36:24 EDT
> From: HazenBannister@cs.com
> To: pianotech@ptg.org
> Subject: Re: no biz
>
>
> In a message dated 9/20/03 10:13:43 AM,
> cedel@supernet.com writes:
>
> << It's the new people that have to wait. If they
> don't want to, I refer
> them to
> someone who can take care of them within a day or
> two or maybe a week. >>
>
> I am probally 25 pianos behind (tuning),plus my
> regular
> appointments,(college-churches),plus several
> rebuilding projects in progress as well.At times
> like
> these,I have other chapter members who will go tune
> for me,under my billing
> head.Of course it must be someone you trust to
> represent you well,and also
> cleared with the customer,if they don't want to
> wait.
> Best,
> Hazen Bannister
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.5 message/rfc822
> Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 21:10:55 -0500
> From: Hechler Family <dahechler@charter.net>
> To: pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Paging "w peterson"
>
>
> Please send me your email address again,
>
> Thank you
>
> --
> Duaine Hechler
> Piano, Player Piano, Organ, Pump Organ
> Tuning, Servicing & Rebuilding
> Associate Member of the Piano Technicians Guild
> Reed Organ Society Member
> St. Louis, MO 63034
> (314) 838-5587
> dahechler@charter.net
>
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.6 message/rfc822
> Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 22:16:40 EDT
> From: Erwinspiano@aol.com
> To: pianotech@ptg.org
> Subject: Glue cleanup on ribs
>
> Trix and I pressed up a S&S O board today. We
> tried using tight bond
> again but tried to get a better feel for just the
> right amount of glue to apply
> so that only a small amount of squezze came at the
> out when we turned up the
> 40 P.S.I air pressure. It worked much better and
> the samller amounts of glue
> were more easily cleaned up with damp rags and dry
> paper towell. With only 11
> ribs the spacing between cauls was wider and 1& 1/2
> hrs. This will probably
> continue to be our chosen method.
> Also on a different subject ,on occasion we've
> had the ribs scoot sideways
> as we apply pressure (this happened with go bars to)
> so we install short
> center pins into the ribs glue surface to keep them
> from skidding sideways when
> the pressures turned up.
> Dale Erwin
> Erwins Piano Restoration
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.7 message/rfc822
> Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 22:22:56 -0500
> From: "Jay Mercier" <custombuilt101@hotmail.com>
> To: pianotech@ptg.org
> Subject: Chickering concert grand serial numbers
>
> A Chickering 9 foot concert grand with serial number
> 15408 is listed in the
> Pierce atlas as being manufactured around the 1850's
> - 1860's. This piano
> doesn't resemble anything manufactured back then -
> it looks more like a
> grand from the 20th century. It does not have the
> square curve, nor is it a
> square grand. It looks very original but not 150+
> years old. It's not ornate
> and with my little experience it fairly resembles a
> some Steinway D pianos
> I've seen. Does anyone know if Chickering concert
> grand serial numbers are
> in a separate catergory from the rest?
>
> Jay Mercier
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
> Instant message with integrated webcam using MSN
> Messenger 6.0. Try it now
> FREE! http://msnmessenger-download.com
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.8 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 13:44:55 +1000
> From: Mark Bolsius <markbolsius@optusnet.com.au>
> To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re: Stuart Piano
>
> From: Mark Bolsius <markbolsius@optusnet.com.au>
> Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 18:39:11 +1000
> To: <pianotech-request@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re Stuart Piano
>
> Hi all,
>
> I've just returned to the pianotech list after
> several years away from
> it....I don't know if I have the time yet to keep
> up...but here goes!
>
> Re the Stuart, I had my first chance to look at and
> do a tiny bit of playing
> on one a couple of weeks ago at the Sydney
> Conservatorium of Music. They've
> just taken delivery of a brand new one. Mr Stuart
> himself had only finished
> the installation prep a few days before, so this
> little guy was as good as
> it could be (without having any "playing in").
>
> RicB your trip to Newcastle will be longer than you
> think...it's Newcastle
> Australia where they are made! Not Newcastle
> England.
>
> I know Ron O would have a few observations about it,
> but I know he has his
> head down at the moment working on finishing the two
> pianos in his workshop.
>
> It's certainly a very different kettle of fish if
> you are comparing with
> Steinway. The sound is quite coloured and varies a
> lot from one section to
> another. RicB Your comment about the octave F4 to F6
> is quite accurate,
> although I'd put it a little higher than that. That
> area gets very choked on
> fortissimo playing. I suspect that the action rails
> are too flexible and the
> distance between action standards too great causing
> the hammers to block in
> the middle of the section.
>
> The belly is huge with quite short ribs and a light
> soundboard. I can't
> verify this, but I believe the crown is also quite
> low. I can't remember if
> the riobs were fanned _ I don't think so, but I'll
> accept whatever someone
> else who's seen might say. The hitch pins are
> adjustable but not like the
> Baldwin pins, they are screw adjustable. The whole
> design makes for a piano
> that delivers quite interesting sounds at low to
> medium volume, but I can't
> say I enjoyed the fortissimo and above. This
> confirmed what I had heard on
> recordings prior to seeing it.
>
> The aggraffes are right the way through the piano.
> He uses Steel wrapped
> bass strings which accounts for a different sound.
> the cross over is not
> pleasant, and as I've already said there are several
> changes in tone and
> envelope over the whole 8 octave range of the
> keyboard (that's right folks 8
> octaves - F0 to F8!! Find an accuTuner or RCT to
> tune those last couple!)
>
> What I really enjoyed was the pianissimo playing and
> possibilities - it has
> four pedals Damper, sostenuto, una corda and half
> blow. The combination of
> half blow and una corda made for the most delicate
> and controlled softs I've
> ever experienced.
>
> The other thing is the aesthetic - It's quite
> beautiful the cabinet is an
> Australian Cedar (they also can be finished in
> birds-eye Huon pine, another
> Australian wood from way down south in Tasmania (get
> your atlases out
> everyone). The standard of finish is impeccable,
> even the backposts
> underneath are as smooth as ...
>
> Wayne Stuart, the creator, is aiming for something
> very different, and he's
> certainly done that. It won't be everyone's cup of
> tea, but he's selling a
> few...I believe Rowan Atkinson the English
> comedian/actor has bought one.
>
> I also had the recent opportunity to do some
> servicing on one of Ron Overs
> early pianos...given the choice I'd take his home
> over the Stuart any day of
> the week! Just my humble opinion.
>
> Looking forward to participating more in the future
>
> Cheers
> Mark Bolsius
> Canberra Australia
>
> (Go on get that world atlas out and see where it
> is!!)
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.9 message/rfc822
> Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2003 20:54:13 -0700
> From: "David Love" <davidlovepianos@earthlink.net>
> To: "Pianotech" <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: RE: Glue cleanup on ribs
>
> Short nails with a sharper and more tapered point
> would probably be better (even predrilled) to insure
> that you don't split the ribs.
>
> David Love
> davidlovepianos@earthlink.net
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
> To: pianotech@ptg.org
> Sent: 9/20/2003 7:16:40 PM
> Subject: Glue cleanup on ribs
>
>
> Trix and I pressed up a S&S O board today. We
> tried using tight bond again but tried to get a
> better feel for just the right amount of glue to
> apply so that only a small amount of squezze came at
> the out when we turned up the 40 P.S.I air
> pressure. It worked much better and the samller
> amounts of glue were more easily cleaned up with
> damp rags and dry paper towell. With only 11 ribs
> the spacing between cauls was wider and 1& 1/2 hrs.
> This will probably continue to be our chosen method.
> Also on a different subject ,on occasion we've
> had the ribs scoot sideways as we apply pressure
> (this happened with go bars to) so we install short
> center pins into the ribs glue surface to keep them
> from skidding sideways when the pressures turned up.
> Dale Erwin
> Erwins Piano Restoration
> ATTACHMENT part 3.10 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 00:12:10 -0700
> From: Robin Hufford <hufford1@airmail.net>
> To: Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re: Chickering concert grand serial numbers
>
> Jay,
> This Chickering concert grand is probably a
> model 141 or 141A with the
> latter being more likely and was built in 1924 or
> 25. You can find the
> designation cast in the plate at the tail of the
> piano. This is the American
> Piano Co period of Chickering's development.
> Regards, Robin Hufford
>
> Jay Mercier wrote:
>
> > A Chickering 9 foot concert grand with serial
> number 15408 is listed in the
> > Pierce atlas as being manufactured around the
> 1850's - 1860's. This piano
> > doesn't resemble anything manufactured back then
> - it looks more like a
> > grand from the 20th century. It does not have the
> square curve, nor is it a
> > square grand. It looks very original but not 150+
> years old. It's not ornate
> > and with my little experience it fairly resembles
> a some Steinway D pianos
> > I've seen. Does anyone know if Chickering concert
> grand serial numbers are
> > in a separate catergory from the rest?
> >
> > Jay Mercier
> >
> >
>
_________________________________________________________________
> > Instant message with integrated webcam using MSN
> Messenger 6.0. Try it now
> > FREE! http://msnmessenger-download.com
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > pianotech list info:
> https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.11 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 01:53:42 EDT
> From: BobDavis88@aol.com
> To: pianotech@ptg.org
> Subject: Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@
> up?
>
> I hit the wrong button earlier, and sent a message
> that wasn't complete. I
> sent a corrected version but it didn't appear.
> Anyway, here's the complete
> message. Not that it's so important, but I hate
> sending out a message that makes no
> sense.
>
> Susan writes:
>
> > You have pointed out the problem yourself: the
> irritation you feel. If you
> > start from a feeling of adequate power over the
> situation, you will probably
> > find yourself putting up with minor noise, almost
> without noticing it. Then
> > when it is simply too bothersome, you put down
> your hammer, walk to the
> > source, and ask them to be quieter. It's
> completely up to you when to do this, so
> > you don't have to suffer long enough to get really
> angry. I think that the
> > anger comes from a sense of helplessness, which is
> a decision on our part.
> >
>
> Well said, Susan,
>
> I remember a busy tuning day years ago, when the
> clock chimed twelve. It
> seemed to take an hour. I was irritated at the
> customer for not noticing and
> turning it off. Then came an epiphany (in the sense
> of "a sudden perception of the
> essential nature or meaning of something" from the
> MW dictionary). If I can't
> stop long enough to let the clock strike, what does
> that say about the nature
> of my relationship to my business!! Ever since,
> every time the clock chimes
> at a customer's house, I smile at the memory of the
> revelation, and take a
> well-deserved couple of deep breaths.
>
> Bob Davis
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.12 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 01:06:43 -0500
> From: Keith McGavern <kam544@gbronline.com>
> To: Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@
> up?
>
> At 1:53 AM -0400 9/21/03, BobDavis88@aol.com wrote:
> >... If I can't stop long enough to let the clock
> strike, what does
> >that say about the nature of my relationship to my
> business!! Ever
> >since, every time the clock chimes at a customer's
> house, I smile at
> >the memory of the revelation, and take a
> well-deserved couple of
> >deep breaths.
>
> Right on there, Bob.
>
> Though I do schedule all my appointments to occur
> right after the
> noon hour strikes :-)
>
> Keith McGavern
> ATTACHMENT part 3.13 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 01:09:51 -0700
> From: Susan Kline <skline@peak.org>
> To: Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re: Noise/"Deaf Tuners"/Susan
>
> At 04:56 PM 9/20/2003 -0700, you wrote:
> >Susan,
> >Your concept of hearing loss is wrong! If you want
> to know why/how, we'll
> >discuss it privately.
>
> Sure, why not?
>
> Susan
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.14 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 01:15:26 -0700
> From: Susan Kline <skline@peak.org>
> To: Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re: How do you get them to shut the #%$@
> up?
>
> At 01:53 AM 9/21/2003 -0400, Bob wrote:
> >I remember a busy tuning day years ago, when the
> clock chimed twelve. It
> >seemed to take an hour. I was irritated at the
> customer for not noticing
> >and turning it off. Then came an epiphany (in the
> sense of "a sudden
> >perception of the essential nature or meaning of
> something" from the MW
> >dictionary). If I can't stop long enough to let the
> clock strike, what
> >does that say about the nature of my relationship
> to my business!! Ever
> >since, every time the clock chimes at a customer's
> house, I smile at the
> >memory of the revelation, and take a well-deserved
> couple of deep breaths.
> >
> >Bob Davis
>
> I love it ...
> and you're right.
>
> Susan
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.15 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 11:14:04 +0200
> From: antares@euronet.nl
> To: Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: life of a piano tuner
>
>
> On zondag, sep 21, 2003, at 10:15 Europe/Amsterdam,
> Susan Kline wrote:
>
> > At 01:53 AM 9/21/2003 -0400, Bob wrote:
> >> I remember a busy tuning day years ago, when the
> clock chimed twelve.
> >> It seemed to take an hour. I was irritated at the
> customer for not
> >> noticing and turning it off. Then came an
> epiphany (in the sense of
> >> "a sudden perception of the essential nature or
> meaning of something"
> >> from the MW dictionary). If I can't stop long
> enough to let the clock
> >> strike, what does that say about the nature of my
> relationship to my
> >> business!! Ever since, every time the clock
> chimes at a customer's
> >> house, I smile at the memory of the revelation,
> and take a
> >> well-deserved couple of deep breaths.
> >>
> >> Bob Davis
> >
> > I love it ...
> > and you're right.
> >
> > Susan
>
> I remember exactly the same thing... I became
> extremely agitated with
> all kinds of sounds. At the time (a long time ago) I
> tuned a zillion
> pianos a year and also the pianos in 400 public
> schools, hospitals and
> public buildings.
> After 10 years of this (I worked for a piano firm
> who had a contract
> with the city of Amsterdam) I wanted to write a book
> about my hateful
> noisy tuning experiences.
> I also had a title for it :
> kinderen, kanaries, en koekoeksklokken (children,
> canaries, and coo
> coo clocks).
>
> I quit that job and I never wrote the book.
>
> (; >))
>
> André Oorebeek
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.16 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 06:21:48 -0400
> From: Clyde Hollinger <cedel@supernet.com>
> To: Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re: life of a piano tuner
>
> Now I'm curious. How many pianos did you tune on a
> yearly basis? If the
> 400 places you mention had only one piano that was
> tuned annually, that
> already sounds to me like six months' work.
>
> Regards, Clyde
>
>
> > I remember exactly the same thing... I became
> extremely agitated with
> > all kinds of sounds. At the time (a long time ago)
> I tuned a zillion
> > pianos a year and also the pianos in 400 public
> schools, hospitals and
> > public buildings.
> > After 10 years of this (I worked for a piano firm
> who had a contract
> > with the city of Amsterdam) I wanted to write a
> book about my hateful
> > noisy tuning experiences.
> > I also had a title for it :
> > kinderen, kanaries, en koekoeksklokken (children,
> canaries, and coo
> > coo clocks).
> >
> > I quit that job and I never wrote the book.
> >
> > (; >))
> >
> > André Oorebeek
>
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.17 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 04:24:09 -0700
> From: Phillip Ford <fordpiano@earthlink.net>
> To: Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re: String vibrations
>
> >Is it possible that there's benefit in eliminating
> the transition from
> >horizontal to vertical vibrations, without regard
> to which isolation
> >approach you take?
> >
> >--Cy Shuster--
> >Rochester, MN
>
> The point that I was trying to make in my earlier
> post was, that it's
> not possible to limit string vibration to one plane,
> whether there
> would be a benefit or not. Unless the string
> terminations are rigid,
> and unless the hammer drives the string perfectly
> vertical, there is
> going to be vibration in both planes. Even if you
> could confine
> string travel to one plane, I'm not sure I see the
> reason. If the
> string could be forced to travel only in a vertical
> plane then the
> string energy would transfer more effectively to the
> bridge and
> board, reducing sustain. If you could confine it
> strictly in the
> horizontal plane, then it would sustain very well,
> but you wouldn't
> hear it, since the vibration energy doesn't transfer
> very effectively
> in that direction. I think you want to have a
> combination of the
> two, which is what nature has conveniently given us.
>
> Phil Ford
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.18 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 04:34:42 -0700
> From: Phillip Ford <fordpiano@earthlink.net>
> To: pianotech@ptg.org
> Subject: Re: String vibrations
>
> >> >Consider:
> >>>
> >>>The Stuart bridge agraffes steer the string
> excursion in the vertical
> >>>direction for better tone and longer sustain.
> >>>
> >>>The Wapin bridge modification steers the string
> excursion in the
> >>>horizontal direction for better tone and longer
> sustain.
> >>>
> >>>Ron N
> >>
> >>-------------
> >>I think that anybody that thinks he is 'steering'
> the string vibration one
> >>way or another is kidding himself.
> >>
> >>Phil Ford
> >
> >
> >I can't say one way or another. I just thought it
> interesting that
> >the two approaches both claim similar benefits from
> opposite
> >approaches to string termination at the bridge.
> >
> >Ron N
>
>
> I agree.
>
> I'm not sure that either of them can achieve their
> claimed behavior,
> but at least the Wapin claim makes sense. The
> Stuart claim doesn't
> make sense to me. Assuming that you could limit
> string vibration to
> a vertical plane, then a higher rate of energy
> transfer from the
> string to the bridge would be the result, which
> doesn't equate to
> longer sustain.
>
> Which is not to say that both string termination
> methods have no
> effect on the tone. I imagine that they do. And
> they may affect the
> relative strengths of the horizontal and vertical
> vibration, and the
> rate of transfer between the two modes. But I don't
> think either
> method will succeed in confining string vibration to
> one plane.
>
> If Wapin thinks that a better tone or sustain
> results from a higher
> percentage of horizontal vibrations, then perhaps
> they should design
> an action in which the hammers strike the strings at
> an angle to the
> string plane so that the string is driven sideways
> as well as up by
> the hammer blow.
>
> Phil Ford
>
> ATTACHMENT part 3.19 message/rfc822
> Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2003 07:35:02 -0400
> From: "Farrell" <mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com>
> To: "Pianotech" <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Subject: Re: Glue cleanup on ribs
>
> Another advantage to laminated ribs!
>
> Terry Farrell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: David Love
> To: Pianotech
> Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2003 11:54 PM
> Subject: RE: Glue cleanup on ribs
>
>
> Short nails with a sharper and more tapered point
> would probably be better (even predrilled) to insure
> that you don't split the ribs.
>
> David Love
> davidlovepianos@earthlink.net
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
> To: pianotech@ptg.org
> Sent: 9/20/2003 7:16:40 PM
> Subject: Glue cleanup on ribs
>
>
> Trix and I pressed up a S&S O board today.
> We tried using tight bond again but tried to get a
> better feel for just the right amount of glue to
> apply so that only a small amount of squezze came at
> the out when we turned up the 40 P.S.I air
> pressure. It worked much better and the samller
> amounts of glue were more easily cleaned up with
> damp rags and dry paper towell. With only 11 ribs
> the spacing between cauls was wider and 1& 1/2 hrs.
> This will probably continue to be our chosen method.
> Also on a different subject ,on occasion
> we've had the ribs scoot sideways as we apply
> pressure (this happened with go bars to) so we
> install short center pins into the ribs glue surface
> to keep them from skidding sideways when the
> pressures turned up.
> Dale Erwin
> Erwins Piano Restoration>
_______________________________________________
> pianotech list info
> https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
>
=====
~LIFE IS LIKE TOILET PAPER...
~THE CLOSER IS GETS TO THE END...
~ THE FASTER IT GOES!!! ~~~wHaHaHa = P
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