Kent Swafford/....ETD generated tuning and refines it."

[Farrell]

"It seems unfair to tune a piano aurally and then grade off if a person's ETD gives different readings.  I cannot imagine an ETD giving exactly the same tuning as an aural one." 

I don't think I quite understand here. Of course the ETD will differ from an aural tuning (although the Verituner might just come surprisingly close if the same tuning criteria were used). This statement sounds like there is an assumption that an ETD calculated tuning should be a best-fit tuning. Probably not a good thing.

IMHO, an ETD should NEVER be trusted to produce a good tuning without aural checks and perhaps adjustments. Now, you may know your ETD well, and know the model of piano being tuned, and trust that the ETD will yield satisfactory results, but even there you have at least indirectly conducted aural checks. If an exam piano has a master tuning recorded on a SAT, and you tune it with your ETD, and the ETD results are not consistent with the master tuning, it would be meaningless to argue that the ETD is "right" and the master is "wrong" (better/worse/whatever) - the only way to argue this would be to provide an aurally-based argument that demonstrated the ETD produced a "better" compromise at the various contested points.

To take an extreme example of this, use a spinet with a well-developed "hockey stick" long bridge for your exam. Surely the aural master tuning will be a fair bit divergent from something that a SAT would calculate. You will loose each time if you try to argue that the straight FAC tuning calculated with the SAT fits the piano scale better than the master tuning.

Terry Farrell
  
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Leslie W Bartlett" <lesbart1@juno.com>
To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 9:31 AM
Subject: Re: Kent Swafford/....ETD generated tuning and refines it."


> That's a significant issue, though. If I chose to take my exam with a
> machine, then  an aurally tuned piano would not completely agree with my
> machine, even if I stopped lights completely.   There is a discrepancy
> which I first noticed when I participated in giving an exam.  It seems
> unfair to tune a piano aurally and then grade off if a person's ETD gives
> different readings.  I cannot imagine an ETD giving exactly the same
> tuning as an aural one. I would even suspect there will grow up a whole
> electronic tuning vocabulary as more and more people turn to them.  It's
> possible that twenty years from now, electronics will become standard 
> and thus alter perceptions of what a "good tuning" is.
> JMO
> les bartlett
> 
> On Sun, 22 Sep 2002 16:37:28 -0700 "Joseph Garrett"
> <joegarrett@earthlink.net> writes:
> > Kent,
> > Of course you are correct. Misstep on my part. ETDs are allowed. 
> > Bremmers
> > comment, if you read it carefully, was that the piano is TUNED with 
> > an ETD
> > and then master tuned, aurally.
> > I personally suggested that be done, a few years ago and was told 
> > absolutely
> > not! Hmm? There definately seems to be some differences of opinion 
> > in the
> > use of an ETD in Master Tuning. To me, this just adds more fuel to 
> > the
> > argument of those who choose NOT to become RPTs or to even join. 
> > I've been
> > hearing that lame argument for years, from the non-PTG crowd, that 
> > they
> > refuse to be pitted against a "Machine".
> > Perhaps someone from the Tuning Test Committee could clarify this, 
> > as I do
> > not have a manual at the ready.
> > Best Regards,
> > Joe Garrett, RPT, (Oregon)
> > 
> > Been There, Didn't Like It, So I'm Here To Stay! [G}
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
> > 
> 
> 
> ________________________________________________________________
> GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
> Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!
> Join Juno today!  For your FREE software, visit:
> http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.
> _______________________________________________
> pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
>