Sustain Time, was: S&S D Duplex

[Ron Nossaman]

>I trust you are being a tad facetious here?

A tad. These times are pitiful, but then the piano is old and dead in this 
case.


>The reason I ask though is because "experts" so often suggest that sustain 
>in the treble should be at least 15 seconds. I always ask where in the 
>treble (can't imagine they are talking about C8), but never seem to get 
>straight forward answers.

Kind of like crown measurements huh?


>I don't think I have ever seen a piano that had 15 seconds of sustain 
>anywhere in the top two octaves.

Del said his A is 12-15 seconds at C-6, which is PDG (like PDQ, only Good). 
A Mason&Hamlin A I did about three years ago was in the 10-12 range there I 
think, but I can't find the figures. I know Del doesn't do this when he 
reports sustain times, and I don't, but remember the comment I made some 
time back about rebuilders checking treble sustain with the dampers down 
before teardown, and with the dampers up after rebuilding to demonstrate 
the big improvement? This may be where the "15 seconds in the treble" stuff 
comes from.


>Can you be more specific as to what sustain times you like to see at C8, 
>C7, C6, C5 and C4 for instance? I realize all pianos are different and so 
>on, but what kind of sustain times at these notes would put a smile on 
>your face? What kind of times would make you frown? Thanks.
>
>Terry Farrell

Boy, this is asking for it, but I'll bite. Anything over 2 solid seconds at 
C-8 is gravy. I've heard over 4. Average is between 1 and 1.5. 1 is too 
frequent. Dink happens. C-7, 5 and above is good, 4 average, and 3 or below 
is sad. C-6, above 9 is good, 7-8 is average, 6 or below is un-good. C-5, 
above 12 is good, 10-12 average, below 10 pitiful. Below that, it isn't 
worth much. Actually, it isn't worth much at C-5, since the awful tone 
character is more evident than the short sustain. It is in the treble too, 
but most people don't seem to notice it. This is pianos of all ages in the 
wild. A rebuilder should hope to be in the high range with these numbers. 
Other opinions welcome, since I haven't spent much time and effort 
documenting this stuff.


>I tuned a Baldwin Hamilton a couple weeks ago that didn't have more than 
>one second of sustain for the entire top three octaves. It must have had a 
>marshmellow bridge or something. My Verituner had a bewildered look on the 
>screen!  :-(

Possibly the famous Seven League Bearing Load resulting from the random 
height bridges. I've seen a couple of those.

Ron N