soundboards improving with age? or what else?

[Richard Brekne]

Having re-read this post at least five times I am left a bit confused about what
your position is really Del.. I wonder if you might clarify a bit.

Delwin D Fandrich wrote:

>
> > I stick by my position that it is simply unknown as yet much about the
> aging
> > process for wood acoustics... mainly because there is practically no
> studies done
> > on the matter... and I doubt none at all relating to piano sound boards.
> That many
> > instruments gain quality due to replacement of said panels can just as
> easily and
> > sensibly be explained in other ways then to simply site some presumed
> > significance of elasticity or presence of resins or what have you.
>
> It is not really the changes that take place in wood due to 'age' as it is
> the changes that take place within the wood structure as a result of applied
> stresses over time. That is different from a piece of wood just set aside to
> 'age.' (And that is a whole other debate...)
>

First off... it baffels me that anyone could think we (I at least, and helped
start this tangent along with Terry) were talking about anything but wood ageing
and how that does or does not affect wood acoustics. That IS what this debate
was about. It was first Andre who insisted upon the "power", "suppleness", and
then "liveliness"  of new wood, citing I might add reasons that sounded pretty
close to our "resins" offshoot to me.  Then you came in the fray with the
structural side of things to which I tried to reply a couple times ..."yes well
and fine... interesting I am sure...etc... (no offense meant Del..grin.. all
that WAS interesting) but... I was asking about "AGEING" and was all along...
which you now declare to be a whole'nother debate..... <Ric scratching his head
wondering which planet he is on now>

>
> > But as I said at the outset... show me the science, the research data that
> supports
> > your statements regarding why new wood is "better" then old. Until then
> its just as
> > much a matter of faith as any other position..... no matter how many
> pianos of
> > whatever quality you, I, or whoever has dealt with.
>
> While I understand that nothing much I have to say will likely be changing
> anybody's mind on this subject, I'd like to suggest that pianos such as
> Andre's Bechstein (was it?) upright with a re-ribbed original soundboard
> panel would sound about the same had the panel been replaced with one of the
> same thickness and mass characteristic made of new wood. It is now the new
> ribs that are supporting crown and forming the stress interface between the
> soundboard assembly and the string plane.

Now THIS is the kicker... and has left me very confused. You appear to be saying
here that you could take any old peice of soundboard wood... perhaps even cut
out a few select chuncks from old beaters with reasonable large sections of ok
soundboard left in them and fashion a panel out of them.... and then glue new
ribs on the back and it would sound just as good as a brand new panel of freshly
cut and handled wood.... just as long as both are rib supported crowns.

If that is indeed what you are saying...then how do you support THAT suspicion.
Which I might add if true would point very strongly in the direction of their
being absolutely no affect whatsover on the acoustics of wood due to any ageing
process. Which I might also add flies directly in the face of the thrust of
your other statements regarding the general issue albiet taken off in your own
"Stresses on the wood over time" tangent.

God... you guys are gonna get me to believe in tinkerbells after all if this
keeps up.  grin...

>
> I suspect the impedance relationship between the soundboard assembly and the
> strings would be about the same in either case.
>

Why ?

>
> Regards,
>
> Del

Hey... how bout them M's ??? Big Grin...

--
Richard Brekne
RPT, N.P.T.F.
Bergen, Norway
mailto:rbrekne@broadpark.no