On Apr 21, 2010, at 9:04 PM, Dennis Johnson wrote: > Interesting story..... but aside from all that, scoring 80% or > better on the exam is really no good measure of ET. Sorry. Bill > Bremmer and I did this a long time ago at one of the Conventions, > can't remember which, but our Victorian Tunings all came in at > around 85%. I wish I could remember more of the specific details, > but this is easily confirmed. I enjoyed the read anyway. Hi Dennis, Yes, I am certainly aware that most "Victorian Tunings" would pass the PTG test, and, indeed, that most of those supposed "quasi-equal" temperaments that Jorgensen so painstakingly calculates and emulates would pass in the 90% and above range. Passionate true believers in the VT (or mild WT, or whatever flavor is preferred) are convinced that the differences between those patterns and ET are significant, even very significant. And yet, all such true believers and practitioners I have talked to or corresponded with is also "sorry to state" that the majority of their customers can not tell the difference. For a small minority it is apparently important, but for most it is imperceptible. So we run up against the question, once again, of where the limits of significance actually lie. Is it, in fact, significant that some small minority can hear the difference and values it? (Well, it is significant for those people, assuming they are actually that acute and sensitive in their hearing and that suggestibility is not a part of the phenomenon). An open question. I certainly have an open mind about the possibility that these differences are significant, but it has not proven true in my own experience, either for myself or for any of my customers. And many colleagues who have been interested have told a similar tale - they offer this wonderful thing, and the customer yawns. Much of the VT style is predicated on "equal-beating" intervals. I believe that is the case with Bill Bremmer and with yourself. Let us remember that "equal-beating" is, without question, the invention of Owen Jorgensen. It was initially a method to come up with approximate aural instructions for temperaments that were really, in practical terms, impossible to achieve. So if the effect of the VT depends on these equal-beating relationships, we are talking about a 20th century creation, not about history. Going back to history and evidence, I am willing to state that the Ellis tunings suggest the possible survival of UET traditions of tuning, specifically narrower fifths on the diatonic keys to produce narrower thirds. "Suggest" and "possible" are key words here. They do not, repeat, do not demonstrate a refined and extraordinarily subtle pattern. They are obviously rough, and it is equally possible to suggest that in such a small sampling the "errors" compared to ET are random. Is 80% on the tuning test a good measure of ET? A very controversial subject, and one in which arguments are almost always based far more on passion than on demonstrable facts. We all like to think of ourselves as more perfect than everyone else, and that our tunings (which are always at 100% of what we aim for <g>) are far better than a mere 80% tuning. But who has actually investigated the question? All I ever see or hear are unverifiable anecdotes, and often when I ask probing questions, they end up being far less conclusive than they appeared. Regards, Fred Sturm fssturm at unm.edu http://www.createculture.org/profile/FredSturm http://www.youtube.com/fredsturm http://www.cdbaby.com/Artist/FredSturm
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