[pianotech] S&S K(52) Restoration

[Encore Pianos]

You have to fill the holes (I am assuming you are talking about the plate
bolt holes in the rim and not those in the plate) either way.  What I do is
run the socket set screw through the plate to the height desired, spin the
flange nut up to the bottom of the plate, run a little masking tape under
the bottom of the bolt to keep epoxy out of it,  spin the nut up out of the
way, slop some epoxy onto the threads, spin the nut down to the top of the
tape, then remove the tape.  You're there.  Not hard or long to do.  Ready
to install after the epoxy sets.   No problems, your mileage may vary, I'll
let Ron speak for himself as he's done tons more of these than I have.
Suffice it to say my conclusion is different than yours about the utility of
this method.

I use the WNG bolts also (they sure are purdy....), but I wouldn't say one
method is better than the other, properly applied.  

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.  

Will

-----Original Message-----
From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf
Of David Love
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2012 6:23 PM
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Subject: Re: [pianotech] S&S K(52) Restoration

By the time you've filled the holes and taken the time to recenter
everything I'm not sure it's really cheaper.  But we all value our labor
differently.  A set of 20 WNG bolts is about $200.  The flange nuts will
slip if not secured and since the bolts are greased, epoxy is less reliable
than you might think.  I've had situations where tightening down the cap
screw caused the flange nut to move but more the case when trying to raise
the plate (lowering is less of a problem) the friction on the bottom of the
plate against the flange nut can cause it to break free so that you are just
spinning the bolt inside it.  Let the buyer beware.  Worrying about saving
$200 in the whole scheme of a belly rebuilding job is pennywise and pound
foolish, IMO, of course.  

David Love
www.davidlovepianos.com


-----Original Message-----
From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf
Of Encore Pianos
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2012 1:54 PM
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Subject: Re: [pianotech] S&S K(52) Restoration

It's cheaper, and he's got 20 holes to deal with.   Once I establish where
the flange nuts should locate, I epoxy them to the socket set screw.  I have
not had a problem with slippage.  

Will Truitt

-----Original Message-----
From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf
Of David Love
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2012 4:30 PM
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Subject: Re: [pianotech] S&S K(52) Restoration

I haven't followed this entire thread but why would you not use the WNG
perimeter bolts?  I used the method outlined below and it works just fine
*but* there are times when the lock washer doesn't lock and attempts to
change the elevation of the plate result in simply moving the socket screws
while the lock washers stay in place resulting in no change in elevation of
the plate.  After that happened once or twice I went to the WNG system.  

David Love
www.davidlovepianos.com


-----Original Message-----
From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf
Of Gene Nelson
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2012 12:47 PM
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Subject: Re: [pianotech] S&S K(52) Restoration

If I get this right the existing plate screw holes get plugged and
re-drilled for the 4" socket set screws.
The new board at the screw locations is counter sunk to accept the serrated
flange nuts (are these the lock variety) that are set deep enough to not
interfere with plate height. Are the shoulders oriented up to support the
plate? Lock tite applied? I suppose that nut and set screw need to turn
together to make adjustment?
The socket screws are adjusted from above with Allen wrench and set high
enough above plate to accept acorn nuts.
thanks
Gene
Sent from my iPhone

On May 29, 2012, at 10:21 AM, Ron Nossaman <rnossaman at cox.net> wrote:

> On 5/29/2012 12:05 PM, Encore Pianos wrote:
>> This is what you need, all from Fastenal: Idea from Ron Nossaman 
>> originally I believe.
>> 
>> 3/8"-16 x 4" Black Oxide Alloy Steel Cup Point Socket Set Screw
>> 
>> 3/8-16 Nickel Plated Acorn Nut
>> 
>> 3/8"-16 Zinc Finish Case Hardened Serrated Flange Nut
>> 
>> The Flange nut is inverted and epoxied in place along the length of 
>> the Allen set screw so that the shank will protrude far enough above 
>> the plate so that you can turn down the acorn nut without bottoming 
>> out before touching the top of the plate.
> 
> Almost. It's a lock nut, and epoxy isn't needed, though I use a drop 
> of
thread locker for insurance when I assemble them. Hint: use a relatively
small diameter lock nut and counter bore the soundboard so it will screw
down flush before installing. It's no fun having the plate still 1/2 a lock
nut's thickness too high while you're setting bearing with a laminated cap
pinned bridge installed.
> 
> RonN