[pianotech] mouse contamination from the dark side

[John Ross]

Thumpe,
How can you make a living?
Obviously only your own personal piano could possibly be 'clean' enough for you to work on.
I am sorry about your health problems that have been caused by exposure to certain things.
Most of us have built up resistance to most things, and are not affected to the extent you are.
I think that you should choose another line of work where you are not exposed to normal everyday hazards.
We have ALL gotten your message, so please stop and desist.
Also Most Respectfully.
John Ross
On 30-07-2012, at 9:21 AM, Euphonious Thumpe <lclgcnp at yahoo.com> wrote:

> 
> "Green Powder" is ARSENIC! I worked on a piano that had this put in it (terrific Ivers and Pond art-deco console) to kill cockroaches, and GOT SICKER THAN I'VE EVER BEEN IN MY LIFE!!! (Details by private request only.)
> As it would have been impossible to remove it all without a total rebuild, it was "Dumpsterized". No piano is worth getting this sick for or, far worse, making the little children thus sick who may be forced, against their intuitive inclinations, to practice upon it!!! (I literally almost died.)
> One more note on the mouse issue:
> Pianos are aesthetic inventions. They serve no purpose but to improve ( hopefully) our aesthetic environment. To some, the augmentation of their acoustic environment is worth sacrificing their olfactory environment with offensive odors. Not me. I hope no human actually LIKES mouse urine: loaded with pheromones which attract other mice from far, far away. (Which can DEFINITELY create a health problem for the owner and his/her family, by the way. I believe that I read it is as far as a mile!) Also, some people have 500 times as many taste-buds per square inch as others, so are much more sensitive to odors. Bad odors cause bad dreams ( according to British researchers, as mentioned on NPR, and my personal experience) and one may thus surmise, depression. I have no use for such in my life, as my aim is perpetual happiness. Nor do I wish to be party to imparting it to others'.
> Thankfully, I have other "irons in the fire" regarding survival, and encourage other "piano technicians" to consider whether it is worth the bad karma of encouraging someone to more highly treasure a mere physical object that has these negative potentialities, by encouraging them to invest in it. With all the cheap and free pianos on craigslist these days (some, that have NOT had mice!) I for one will not encourage anyone who has a piano with more than a couple of "droppings", or a nest in it, to keep it. And if such means that a "technician", because of the prevalence of such pianos in their area, needs to find additional means of survival to remain thus ethical, so be it. Better that, than having to answer to God for encouraging people to keep something in their home that is a genuine, documented hazard on several levels. 
> 
> Most Respectfully,
> Thumpe
> 
> P.S. I once had a GORGEOUS 1890's Everett upright ( with "bowling alley" keybed, etc.) with little tabs cast into the back of the pedals, pointing downward, so that even when in the "up position", no access was granted to rodents! How many MILLIONS of pianos could have been saved, if this cheap, minute feature had been used!
> 
> From: Mark Purney <mark.purney at mesapiano.com>; 
> To: <pianotech at ptg.org>; 
> Subject: Re: [pianotech] mouse contamination from the dark side 
> Sent: Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:32:47 PM 
> 
> Douglas,
> 
> I'm glad you have the background to help us separate fact from misconceptions. It's okay to for us to be a little paranoid or err on the side of being extra cautious, but not okay for us to spread misinformation or to exaggerate the facts to spread fear that isn't based on reality.
> 
> So obviously, the threat of disease isn't quite what some of us have made it out to be, and the threat is virtually non-existent beyond a few days. Although that's comforting news, I don't know if I'd be any less careful in the presence of such a piano.  If I open a piano and it smells of urine and has evidence of nesting mice, how am I going to know if the infestation took place many years ago, or if it's currently happening?  Unless I'm 100% certain, I'm not going to take any chances or be any less careful.
> 
> I feel the same way about green powder. I've been told it's highly toxic and dangerous, so I won't work on a piano that has it. Maybe I'm overreacting out of ignorance, but I'd rather be a healthy idiot than an informed hospital patient. :)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 7/29/2012 12:04 PM, Douglas Gregg wrote:
> >  Euphonious,
> > There is no anger on my part. I am just bothered by regularly seeing
> > scarey posts on hantavirus with a great deal of paranoia about mouse
> > dirt. I know we live in a media world that likes to make a lot out of
> > viruses, but they just are not that tough. I worked for 30 years with
> > some of the worst viruses in the world, and we did it every day
> > without that much concern, except when we were growing large
> > quantities in cells. We also often did tests on new viruses to
> > determine survivability of the virus on inanimate objects.  For the
> > most part,  enveloped viruses such as hantavirus are very labile and
> > quickly die outside of a living cell. No viruses are free living
> > animals. They only contain some nucleic acid and a few proteins and
> > must reproduce inside of a living cell. They can only survive briefly
> > outside of a cell. This is particularly true of the ones that are
> > surrounded by an envelope. The envelope is a very thin membrane
> > similar to the cell membrane. It is very sensitive to all kinds of
> > disinfectants, drying, sunlight, and heat. Just give them a few days
> > and they are dead. We spent a lot more effort trying to keep viruses
> > alive in the lab than trying to kill them.
> > 
> > Mouse urine smell is tenacious but viruses are not. Almost any
> > detergent will kill the hantavirus if they are even still there when
> > you start your work, which is unlikely..
> > 
> > Respectfully submitted,
> > Douglas Gregg
> > Classic Piano Doc
> > Retired veterinary pathologist
> > (specialist in virus pathogenesis at Plum Island Animal Disease Center)
> > Plum Island is the equivalent of the CDC for animal diseases
> > 
> 

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