[pianotech] Square Grand?

limhseng at gmail.com limhseng at gmail.com
Fri Aug 27 14:32:09 MDT 2010


Hi Joe and thanks to all who responded this topic.  That means I am out since my height is abt 5' 4'' :<

Lim
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-----Original Message-----
From: "Joseph Garrett" <joegarrett at earthlink.net>
Sender: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2010 22:22:53 
To: tnrwim at aol.com<tnrwim at aol.com>; <pianotech at ptg.org>
Reply-To: joegarrett at earthlink.net, pianotech at ptg.org
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Square Grand?

Wim,
Yes.<G>(that's the short answer.) 
I had a very good Mentor who showed me the correct ways of tuning the square grand. The mechanical aspects, for whatever reason, came naturally and I've had very little trouble with any, except a very early Chickering....whole different critter to be sure.
While I'm at it, I've come to the opinion that a tuner needs to be at least 5'6" tall and no taller than 6'2" to tune a square grand, in reasonable comfort. Outside of those perameters, it's a definate trip to the chiropractor.<G> There are many tricks, that I've picked up over the years. I have over 80 square grands in my data base; about 1/3 I service on some kind of regularity. I wasn't kidding about the 3 in on day thing. I did it and still was vertical. (Of course a good stiff Scotch that evening certainly made the back less of a problem.
Most techs would say:"Gosh, I've only seen a couple of them in my career." Reason is, they didn't put out the word that they would be willing and actually do them. Once the word gets out, the darned things seem to have puppies er sumpin'!!!

Best regards,
Joe

Joe Garrett, R.P.T. (Oregon)
Captain, Tool Police
Squares R I



----- Original Message ----- 
From: 
To: joegarrett at earthlink.net;pianotech at ptg.org
Sent: 8/26/10 12:06:29 PM 
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Square Grand?


Joe

Thank you for a very good explanation on how to work on a square grand. From the description of your excellent directions, it is quite apparent that you have LOTS of experience. For someone like you, working on a square is easy, But let me ask you this question. How long did it take you to tune your first square, or regulate your first action? Did you have any difficulties, or are you so good, that you did it right the first time?  :)

Wim





-----Original Message-----
From: Joseph Garrett <joegarrett at earthlink.net>
To: pianotech <pianotech at ptg.org>
Sent: Thu, Aug 26, 2010 5:31 am
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Square Grand?


Wim said: "Lim 
  


Sometimes, unless you've got a lot of time on your hands, and are prepared not to charge the customer for the amount of time it will take you to tune and regulate the piano, perhaps the best advice I can give you for working on a square grand is, DON"T."

Willem,
Although your advice is sound, most of your statements are just not so! 1."Tuning a square grand is challenging, to say the least." If that were true, then how is it that I've done 3 in one day? It just takes special tools and techniques.<G>  2."The strings do not line up with the tuning pins, like on a grand or upright." No they don't, but the tuning pin area has the notes "penned " in. A thorough cleaning before tuning will usually make them ledigle. (Yes the lid has to come off!) 3."The first thing I would do is remove the rail that goes across the dampers. That makes it a little easier to follow the strings to the pins." Nope. The first thing to remove is the music desk. (right side bracket and then the vertical...carefully.) Second thing is to remove the lid. the third thing is the damper upstop rail. (be very careful not to drop the nuts into the action cavity...it's easy to do DAMHIK!)
4."If you have never worked on a square grand, I would advice you not to try to regulate one without a very good understanding of regulating a grand action. " Wrong again! The principles are the same to a certain point. However, the square grand is a "Single Escapement Action" and is quit easy to regulate! The hardest part is getting the hammers aligned to the strings, (special tools needed!). Once that is accomplished, do the let off, (1/8" throughout, if the hammers are in good condition and haven't had over 1/16" filed off, (Not usually the case). If more than 1/16" has been 'ground' off, then compensate for that by allowing more let off distance. All of that is predecated on a 3/8/" dip and the keys need to be leveled, of course. Key leveling can only be accomplished with the 'stack' removed! Do Not try to do that with the stack on! You'll screw up things fer sure!<G> Set the back check to 5/8" and you can get it real close, simply by doing the tes t where you have one ha
 nd on the hammner and the other on the key. Rock back and forth. If the tail drags, at all, on backcheck, it's set too high! One final criteria: You must have a minute amount of lost motion between the jack and the hammer butt leather! Of course, all of the jack springs need to have good spring cord, properly installed. The amount of spring tension is the most critical of all! Too much and the jack will hang up on the butt...too little and the jack cannot force it's way under the butt leather. With a key out, lift the jack to where the spring  cord "just" becomes tight with the spring. The jack should be at 45 degree angle when that happens, give or take 5 degrees!
Well, that's the short version, but it's really not difficult. Tedious? Yes. Difficult? No.<G>
Regards,
Joe


Joe Garrett, R.P.T. (Oregon)
Captain, Tool Police
Squares R I
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