Piano Sound: was something else

[Farrell]

"Some pianos ( Boesendorfer, old Chickerings, Emersons, etc. ) use spruce for case and beams, so that some of the energy transmitted to them will still be converted to audible resonance."

Are you saying that a Bosendorfer outer rim produces audible sound?

"Spruce, while light, is still considered a "hardwood" as the fibers between the rfesonant vacuous cells are tightly compacted."

Who or what industry considers spruce to be a hardwood? There are indeed soft hardwoods and hard softwoods, but spruce is a soft softwood. There is nothing hardwood about it.

"On many old pianos the cases were also veneered with rosewood or ebony. This was not just cosmetic, as these very dense woods transmited vibrations around the case..."

Even veneers are transmitting? How have you come to this conclusion?

Terry Farrell
  
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "gordon stelter" <lclgcnp@yahoo.com>
To: "Pianotech" <pianotech@ptg.org>
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 4:56 AM
Subject: Re: Piano Sound: was something else


> Well, it WILL reflect some vibration back, regardless.
> The stiffer, denser, and more rigid the rim is, the
> more vibrations will be relected back into the board.
> What is not reflected will be tranmitted to the
> case/rim, and either carried back to the board
> somewhere else or dissipated as heat in the rim wood
> fibers. I think it is optimal that this vibration be
> dissipated by heat in the lampshades and curtains of
> the room the piano sits in, not the piano itself.  In
> other words, as much of the pianist's finger pressure
> as possible should be converted to sound and LEAVE the
> piano, before being absorbed by soft materials. I
> believe the softer case woods in many modern pianos,
> Asian or otherwise, largely contributes to their
> relatively impotent tone when compared to high quality
> pianos from 100 years ago!!!
>      That said, the relationship between stiffness and
> density will play a vital role in the piano's tonal
> "personality". Some pianos ( Boesendorfer, old
> Chickerings, Emersons, etc. ) use spruce for case and
> beams, so that some of the energy transmitted to them
> will still be converted to audible resonance. Spruce,
> while light, is still considered a "hardwood" as the
> fibers between the rfesonant vacuous cells are tightly
> compacted. So it has both high transmittal and
> resonant properties. But not the best reflective  
> properties when used in a case application, as it is
> not dense enough, overall, to make extremely rigid
> structures.
>      At the other extreme are old Knabes, which have
> the most "rock hard" rims (and cases) I have ever
> seen! In these pianos a fast, loud, rather hard tone
> is emitted, as vibrations are quickly kicked back to
> the board, which is held very rigidly by massive rock
> maple cases.  I have seen many 100 year old Knabes
> with excellent crown.  It should also be noted that
> these boards have a heavy coat of finish, usually
> shellac, which is extremely stiff ( and brittle ) when
> fully cured. This brittleness surely aids vibrations
> as they travel across the face of the board. ( But I
> use 2 part "conversion" varnish, as it also has this
> property but is more impervious to humidity, and is
> inedible to the house crickets that live here. "Down
> side" is that it emits formaldehyde fumes like crazy
> for several months as it cures. ) 
>      On many old pianos the cases were also veneered
> with rosewood or ebony. This was not just cosmetic, as
> these very dense woods transmited vibrations around
> the case to where they could be re-absorbed by the
> board. The builders new this.
>     Gordon Stelter
> 
> --- Tony Caught <caute@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
> > So you says that a rim  reflects or has to reflect
> > ?. And why should it. ?
> > 
> > Tony Caught
> > caute@optusnet.com.au
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Richard Brekne" <Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no>
> > To: "Pianotech" <pianotech@ptg.org>
> > Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 5:13 PM
> > Subject: Piano Sound: was something else
> > 
> > 
> > > We keep ridiculing this, without really knowing
> > what it refers too.
> > Similiar subjects come up and get discounted more or
> > less out of hand also.
> > Yet much is made of the importance of string /
> > soundboard impedance match to
> > sustain and power. Perhaps there are other
> > "impedance matches" to the
> > strings energy that play an important / significant
> > roll in the "end
> > product" sound of the piano. Perhaps its not so much
> > a matter of whether one
> > rim reflects more  or better then another... but
> > rather that one rim
> > relfects an optimal amount.. ??
> > >
> > > RicB
> > >
> > > Farrell wrote:
> > >
> > > > This is what I am describing on the S&S upright.
> > And are you speaking in
> > reference to the "magic circle of sound"? Does a
> > laminated rim "reflect"
> > sound better than a solid timber frame?
> > > >
> > > > Terry Farrell
> > > >
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > pianotech list info:
> https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
> 
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