Pitch Raise Speed/etc., was: Steinway vs. The Tuner

[David M. Porritt]

Hints on speed..... Don't use mutes.  Listen carefully.  With
TuneLab, use the spectrum display to see the different strings come
up to pitch.  

dave

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********

On 9/13/2002 at 8:01 AM Mike and Jane Spalding wrote:

>Terry,
>
>Well, at 4 years you've got a 1 1/2  year head start on me.  I've
got
>similar questions, so have paid attention to answers shen I hear
them. 
>Haven't necessarily been able to put them into practice, but maybe
they'll
>help you some:
>
>>But that implies that when you adjust each pin, you will be getting
the
>string pitch to within a cent of target.
>
     
> or
>>I could simply pull every tenth string 20 cents sharp 
>
>I think the really fast pitch raisers are doing something in
between.  Jim
>Coleman Sr., in his class in Chicago, talked about moving each
string only
>one time, keeping a mental note of whether it ended up a little high
or a
>little low, and compensating on the next one.  You'd still need to
have a
>pretty good hand, but the key to speed would be to maintain the
mental
>discipline that if you've got it closer than it was, don't fiddle
with it,
>just keep moving on to the next string.  I think I can do a big
pitch
>raise faster than a small one, because I am mentally less uptight
about
>accuracy.  If the piano is 50c flat, and I'm landing most strings
within
>5c, I figure I'm making enough of an improvement to justify the 30
minutes
>I'm spending on the pitch raise.    
>
>>So the question is then do you base your overpulls on an initial
>characterization of piano pitch, or on the next >few strings as you
go. I
>always do it on the next few strings as I go.
>
>Yes, definitely, make your overpull calculation on the pitch of the
string
>at the time you are tuning that string, not on where it was before
you
>started your tuning.  This is how RCT and Tunelab do it.
>
>New question:  I pitch raise using TL or RCT, from bottom to top,
unisons
>as I go.  The farther up I am, the slower it goes.  Fatigue, yes.
Harder
>to hear and make small movements in the high treble, yes.  But
mostly,
>clumsy handling the mutes through the top section of dampers in a
>vertical.  I hit this section, slow way down, and it's hard to get
moving
>again even after I'm past the dampers.  Any hints, motivational
tips,
>whatever?
>
>Mike Spalding RPT
>
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: Farrell <mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com>
>To: Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org>
>Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 7:05 AM
>Subject: Re: Pitch Raise Speed/etc., was: Steinway vs. The Tuner
>
>
>> I agree that one will benefit from doing a separate pitch raise
pass on
>a piano that is 4 cents flat (IMHO, even 2 cents). > 
>> I have been tuning for 4 years. I am still running at a steady 30
>minutes for a fairly accurate pitch raise pass. My tuning time
(tuning
>every string, i.e. not just a touch-up) is anywhere from 45 minutes
on a
>real nice piano that has not wandered much to about 75 minutes on
nasty
>consoles and the like. I read many posts on the pitch raise subject
where
>it is said "no, no, no, don't worry about accuracy here, you are
just
>trying to get the tension up" or whatever. Well, no, you are trying
to get
>each string pitch to within a cent or so of target - or what? If I
were
>just trying to get overall tension up, - but I don't think that
would be a
>great pitch raise.
>> 
>> Please, I am not trying to say that it must take 30 minutes to do
a good
>pitch raise. I am posting this because I want to be faster. But I
have a
>hard time understanding what I can do so very differently to go
THREE
>TIMES FASTER.
>> 
>> And a second pitch raise topic here. I tuned a Yamaha C3 yesterday
that
>was 3 to 5 cents flat (based on checking all the As and Ds). Another
>reason to do a separate pitch raise pass in this situation is that
when
>the piano is this far off, there are likely other notes even further
from
>target. A number of strings were 10 to 15 cents off, and one string
on A#7
>was 67 cents flat! I think it is analogous to the "where there is
smoke
>there is fire" (sorry B. Clinton).
>> 
>> A third pitch raise topic here. I have never seen addressed the
>phenomenon of a piano below pitch dropping even more in pitch while
pitch
>raising (hmmm....doesn't seem to make any sense). This especially
applies
>to ETD users when calculating overpull. Let's say you have a piano
that is
>uniformly 20 cents flat. Start pitch raising at A0 with your 17% and
25%
>overpulls. By the time you get to F5, check the pitch of the strings
above
>F5 - they will likely be at least 30 cents flat, if not a bit more
flat. > 
>> And a fourth pitch raise topic here........ Oh heck, I think I'll
just
>go clean my shop..........
>> 
>> Terry Farrell
>>   
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Vanderhoofven" <dkvander@joplin.com>
>> To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
>> Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 1:46 AM
>> Subject: Re: Steinway vs. The Tuner, Round One (Long)
>> 
>> 
>> SNIP
>> > 
>> > Did you do a pitch correction while tuning?  If so, how much
pitch 
>> > change?  A pitch change of more than 4 cents requires a separate
>tuning 
>> > pass to do the fine tuning.  Do the pitch correction very
quickly (10
>or 20 
>> > minutes max... Don't worry, you will get that fast with
practice),
>then 
>> > follow-up with a fine tuning.
>> > 
>> SNIP
>> > 
>> > Sincerely,
>> > 
>> > David A. Vanderhoofven
>> > Joplin, MO
>> > 
>> > P.S.  I welcome any constructive criticism about this post.
Please
>let me 
>> > know if I am way off base here.
>> > 
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > pianotech list info:
https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
>> 
>
>_______________________________________________
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_____________________________
David M. Porritt
dporritt@mail.smu.edu
Meadows School of the Arts
Southern Methodist University
Dallas, TX 75275
_____________________________