Noisy action

[jolly roger]

Hi Jeannie,
                  A flimsy frame of soft wood, high strike weight, and
heavier hornbeam parts makes perfect sense.
Maticulous bedding of back rail and dags can make a big difference.  The
back rail cloth bothers me also.  I would be tempted use a thinner cloth
glued at both edges with a softer ( Thick name board felt will do)  unglued
felt in the middle.  Or a varient of the Yamaha method.  Thats how they
achieve quiet operation with their soft wood frames.
Food for thought.
see ya in Reno
Roger



At 05:20 PM 6/6/01 -0700, you wrote:
>Roger,
>I did check most of the things on your list, but you mentioned a few I might
>want to examine more closely.  This actually made noise in my lap, too.  The
>overall impression I got was that the key frame was too flimsy for that was
>going on above top of it!  Does this make sense?  I'm not sure what hammers
>were on it.  I think I mentioned it was a Renner action, but I haven't
>looked at any specs yet to find out what kind of hammers Walter is using.
>It certainly surprised me to find the back rail cloth glued on wrong.
>
>jeannie
>
>Jeannie Grassi, RPT
>Associate Editor, Piano Techncians Journal
>mailto:jgrassi@silverlink.net
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-pianotech@ptg.org [mailto:owner-pianotech@ptg.org]On Behalf
>Of jolly roger
>Sent: Wednesday, June 06, 2001 4:42 PM
>To: pianotech@ptg.org
>Subject: Re: Noisy action
>
>
>Hi Jeannie,
>                  A check list for some obscureaction noises that comes to
>mind.  In no Particular order.
>
>1.   Jack adjustment button,  if the button felt is too hard it can make
>quite a racket when it hits the spoon.  Replacement is the best solution.
>2.   Knuckles, under felt and leather, if they are too hard,  this will
>make a lot of noise. You can stretch the leather a little rolling a needle
>between the felt and leather.  But replacement is the prefered solution.
>3.   Rest rail felt, combined with poor hammer shank clearance, and weak
>rep springs.  Or rest rail set too high.  Thickness of a hammer shank is
>about right.
>4.   Key bedding.  Well, I know that you know how to check that.  but
>remember the back rail. If the BR is too high, it is possible for the FR
>and BR to be bedded fine, but the back rail is slapping.  If this is the
>probem,5.   Unicorda lever height.  Some times its just a little too long,
>and will lift the action off the bed a tad.  Lots of funny noises.
> 6.  Dags too loose, causing keyframe to slap. Use a few thicknesses of
>masking tape to build up the frame so it is nice and snug, to check.    If
>it is the cause, glue a strip of veneer on the top side of the frame, then
>sand to fit. Back and front rails should be checked and fitted with the
>glide bolts backed out first, for best results.   Expect some major dip/
>key height work if this is the cause
>7.   Cheek blocks too tight causing action to bow up in the centre.
>8.   Back rail key felt glued down on the back edge.  The felt is too hard
>or has been soaked with too much glue. I note you say it was glued
>incorrectly.  I would think of replacing one strip, to check.
>9.   Chucking keys or loose BR bushings.
>10.  High strike weight for the frame rigidity,  nature of the beasty.
>Possible with many German hammers and a light frame.
>
>Just some ramblings that may help
>Regards Roger
>
>
>
>
>At 08:56 AM 6/6/01 -0700, you wrote:
>>Hello All,
>>I'm wondering if many of you have had a chance to tune a new Charles Walter
>>Grand?  I finally got a chance yesterday.  Lovely instrument.  But the
>>complaint from the customer was about "excessive action noise".  This is
>>specifically the noise that appears when the action parts (wippens,
>hammers,
>>keys) are dropping back to rest position.  Of course this happens in every
>>action, but it did seem rather noisy for a piano of this quality with a
>>Renner action.  I'm wondering if this is typical of this piano and what
>>might be done to improve it?
>>
>>The keyframe did need a little bedding but I noticed no appreciable
>>difference in the noise after correcting that.  The rest of the regulation
>>was close enough to expect less noise.  The back rail cloth was glued on
>one
>>edge only, but it was the rear edge, which is the opposite to what I would
>>expect.  I loosened the glue joint under the cloth in some spots expecting
>>to hear a huge difference, but no appreciable change. All rails, flanges,
>>brackets, etc. that are supposed to be tight, were tight.
>>
>>Anyone have similar experience with this piano or any more ideas for this
>>sort of thing in general?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>jeannie
>>
>>Jeannie Grassi, RPT
>>Associate Editor, Piano Technicians Journal
>>mailto:jgrassi@silverlink.net
>>
>