SV: alternative temperaments

Ola Andersson pianola@online.no
Fri, 6 Apr 2001 00:10:23 +0200


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Hi Paul and the rest of the gang

First=20
I think I'm about where you are trying to do HT by ear. I'm a newbi and =
learning
There have been little aural descriptions of HT on this list.
I have therefor calculated all thirds, sixth, fiths and fourths of the =
Young and Viallotti temprements.

This two temprements are very much the same. The only differense is that =
one pure 5th is moved to the other side. Young favours the sharp keys =
and Vallotti the flat keys. The bad 5ths and 4ths are twice as bad as =
ET. The double speed.
In Vallotti all 5ths and 4ths with a black are pure. In the Young F-C =
have been made pure and F#-B bad. You maybe know this though.

I'm tuning the Young this way=20
D4 to A3 2 bps. E4 to A3 1.5 bps
Then I tune A#3 to D4 as a normal ET third=20
Then I tune pure fiths/ fourths A#3 - F3 -C3=20
Now I can put G3 between C4 and D4. G3-C4 4beats the same time as G3-D4 =
beats 3 beats
Check if they are as bad as A3-E4 and A3-D4
If you are not happy, retune

Then tune A#3 - D#4 -G#3 -C#4 - F#3 pure 5ths and 4ths=20
Then put B3 between F#3 and E4 as contigues 4ths. B3-E4 4beats the same =
time as F#3-B3 3beats
If I'm lucky this last bad 4ths fits with A3-E4 and A3-D4 and G3-D4 and =
G3-C4



All bad 5ths and 4ths should have this relation (as in Vallotti, ET or =
Meantone)
when the mutual note is the lower the 4th will beat 4 times when the 5th =
beat 3 times
the same as contigues 4ths
When the mutual note is the upper
the 5th will beat 2 times when the 4th beat 3 times as contigues 5ths

To check a pure 5th or 4th use the minor third (of the minor chord) =
below
like the A#3-F4 5th. C#3-A#3 same speed as C#3-F4=20
or the A#3-D#4 4th. F#3-A#3 same speed as F#3-D#3


The Vallotti will be very much the same
D4 to A3 2 bps. E4 to A3 1.5 bps
then I tune C#4 to A3 as a normal ET third=20
Then I tune C#4 - F#3 - B3 as pure 5ths and 4ths
Check if B3-E4 fits with E4-A3 and A3-D3
If you are happy with it
Tune the rest of the 5ths and 4ths with 1 or 2 blacks pure. C# - G#3 - =
........-F3
Tune F and C and G as bad 5ths and 4ths

I can mail you the beats for both temprements if you want them
You can use a metronome instead of a tuner.=20
I have also calculated the beats per minute for metronome.=20

There may be a better way to tune this auraly but this is the best way I =
figured out
I'm not ready to do this for a costumer yet.
It would be fun to share our experience private

Everybody experienced PLEASE come with comments espesilly if I'm on the =
wrong track.
I don't have the Owens book
I hope I got everything right and I hope you undestand my English.

Ola Andersson
Bergen, Norway


  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Paul=20
  To: pianotech@ptg.org=20
  Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2001 3:36 PM
  Subject: alternative temperaments


  Jim Coleman Sr., and List

  I tried my hand at tuning the temperament that Ed Foote included with =
his class materials at the St. Louis Seminar. Great class, Ed. I'm an =
aural tuner, so setting this temperament was a bit of a struggle. It did =
work out. All of the checks proofed correct. I had several people try =
the piano. Their reactions is another story. I want to know what is =
available for tuning instructions for some of these temperaments for an =
aural tuner, specifically the Kirnberger, Young, Broadwood Best, and Jim =
Coleman's temperaments 11 through 16. Would a chromatic tuner which =
displays cents deviation be of any help? I can't afford an ET right now, =
but I'm very interested in these temperaments and have several people =
wanting to try them.
   Anybody?

  Paul Chick

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