I rebate it off the bill if they go ahead. On major service jobs. No no real freebies. Roger At 09:24 PM 4/4/01 -0700, you wrote: >>I hope you don't do free estimates. > >I agree! Do any techs on the List give free estimates? > >David. > > > >> >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: "pryan2" <pryan2@the-beach.net> >>To: <pianotech@ptg.org> >>Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 7:41 PM >>Subject: To tune or not to tune? >> >> >>> This week (and it's only Thursday) I have been called out to tune three >>> un-tunable (upright) pianos which the owners indicated on the phone >were >>> tunable, even though they were 80 to 100 years old. When I arrived at >>the >>> homes, the pianos were wrecks with the expected rust, corrosion, and >rot. >>> To these owners, a tuning meant a rebuild. In each case, I left without >>> tuning. How can I avoid this in the future? Is there a number of >>years-old >>> that you will not go out for a tuning? How do I weed out the tunable >>> pianos from the un-tunable pianos on the phone? >>> >>> Phil Ryan >>> Miami Beach, FL >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "David Love" <davidlovepianos@hotmail.com> >>> To: <pianotech@ptg.org> >>> Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2001 1:38 AM >>> Subject: Re: Pin fluids..was-- Bridge caps >>> >>> >>> > >>> > Jim: >>> > >>> > Would you then consider using varnish as driving fluid on a >restringing >>> job >>> > where you are reusing the old block? With what effect? >>> > >>> > David Love >>> > >>> > >From: JIMRPT@AOL.COM >>> > >Reply-To: pianotech@ptg.org >>> > >To: pianotech@ptg.org >>> > >Subject: Pin fluids..was-- Bridge caps >>> > >Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2001 01:00:58 EDT >>> > > >>> > > >>> > >In a message dated 4/03/2001 10:41:07 PM, Dale wrote: >>> > > >>> > ><<"I've wondered about driving fluids >>> > > >>> > >as well but have not used them.">> >>> > > >>> > >Dale a Cuba Libre ain't bad on a warm day and...... it sho makes >>working >>> > >less >>> > >painful! :-) >>> > > >>> > > Undoubtedly you will get several "opinions" in this thread so >here's >>> > >mine....OK? >>> > >A good pin driving aid will contain 3(?) qualities and these are: >>> > >1.) ease of use/application. >>> > >2.) consistency of results. >>> > >3.) aid in stringing effort. >>> > > >>> > > My favorite weapon of choice is Spar Varnish because it is: >>> > >1.) easy to use/apply. (little dab'll do you and too much won't >effect >>> long >>> > >term results. >>> > >2.) gives verrry consistent results. >>> > >3.) makes stringing sooo much easier (particuarly if you use a T >>handle >>> > >like >>> > >I do. >>> > > >>> > > The varnish acts as a sealer/lubricant while it is still wet and as >>a >>> > >sealer/ snap retardant when it is dry. Turning pins in a wet pinblock >>> > >treated >>> > >with varnish is aprox 1/4 to 1/3 easier than turning them when the >>block >>> is >>> > >dry. >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > <<"I'm using buldoc/stwy blocks in all >>> > > >>> > >stwys/Rebuilds and the pins are hard to drive and no matte how >>> consistently >>> > > >>> > >I drill I.E. same speed,pressure and air cooling there will always be >>> some >>> > > >>> > >tortional inconsistencies. That being said I mostly like how they >>> tune.">> >>> > > >>> > > The five ply blocks you are using are very good blocks...but like >>most >>> > >things they do have some drawbacks chief of which is what mayyyy be >>> termed >>> > >soft spotitis. >>> > > This happens when two or more layers of the pinblock have 'soft' >>spots >>> > >lined >>> > >up vertically. The result of this is that when you drill the holes >>they >>> > >will >>> > >be a trifle larger in the 'soft spots' then in the relatively >'harder' >>> rest >>> > >of the block...........also these 'soft spots' will not hold a pin >>with >>> the >>> > >same force as will the 'harder' portions of the plank....this results >>in >>> > >your >>> > >"tortional inconsistencies'. Just the way things are with these >>> > >blocks...don't mean they are 'bad'. Short of hand picking ass'td size >>> pins >>> > >for preselected holes I don't know any cure for this symptom. >>> > > >>> > >In a 5 ply block with two soft spots together this "spotitis" will >>effect >>> > >aprox. 40% of the pin length...or if the first 4 layers are all that >>are >>> > >contacted it will effect aprox. 50% of the pin length....how much >this >>> will >>> > >effect the "inconsistencies" you are speaking of is relative to the >>rest >>> of >>> > >the block. >>> > > >>> > > If'n y'all likes the way dey tune, and all the other parameters of >>> > >stability, etc. are there, then keep on keepin on. >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > <<"My question is this. For those of you who are using maple >>blocks >>> and >>> > > >>> > >driving fluids ,do you think it affects tuning smoothness, changes >>> > >tortional >>> > > >>> > >values or is it just a way to make driving a pin easier. My >>> > >srtinger(Terry) >>> > > >>> > >is a little five ft. Italian gal and although plenty fiesty would >>> > >appreciate >>> > > >>> > >any help in the driving each new One ought pins into freshly bored >>> > >maple.:>> >>> > > >>> > > Varnish treated blocks definitely have fewer 'snappers' than do non >>> > >treated >>> > >blocks,.....in my experience. Driving in the pins is much easier and >>> > >setting >>> > >coils, applying tension and chipping are all easier by 'far' while >the >>> > >varnish is still at least damp. >>> > >1/0 pins??? Why do you use 1/0 pins? In my opinion 1/0 pins add a >>measure >>> > >of >>> > >flagpoling/twistyness that I don't like, but if there is a gooood >>reason >>> > >for >>> > >using them I might reconsider my thoughts here. >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > <<"Also if driving fluid changed slightly the pin torque and >>allowed >>> for >>> > > >>> > >smoother rendering that would be fine.">> >>> > > >>> > > Dale, treating or not treating the pins/pinblock has absolutely >>nothing >>> > >to >>> > >do with string rendering other than making the tuning pin easier to >>> > >manipulate. However that being said I will contradict myself and say >>that >>> > >having to fight the pin less will allow you to 'feel' the rendering >>much >>> > >better....or is that what you meant? >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > ><<"The finest tuning piano in the world >>> > > >>> > >is an old steinway thats never yet been restrung. You know the kind >>,well >>> > > >>> > >preserved and unadulterated. The pin torque is so even and the >tuning >>> ends >>> > > >>> > >up being so stable because the pin doesn't wrestle with the >>tuner!!!!">> >>> > > >>> > >Betcha a LARGE cup of coffee that this pinblock was treated with >>varnish >>> > >during stringing...wanna bet? :-) >>> > >My opinion. >>> > >Jim Bryant (FL) >>> > >p.s. Do a test for yourself....take a scrap piece of >pinblock....drill >>> > >three >>> > >holes... >>> > >drill one hole 17/64ths and two holes 1/4"..............(adjust for >>your >>> > >favorite sizing/feel).....in the 17/64 and first 1/4 >>> hole..........install >>> > >2/0 pins to the level where they would normally be after >chipping/coil >>> > >setting/tapping.......in the last 1/4 hole (for the test only) wet a >>> small >>> > >piece/wad of paper towel with spar varnish and push through the >>pinblock >>> > >with >>> > >a hammer shank...install the pin to the same level as the other two >>> pins(be >>> > >sure and mark the holes as to which is what:). Immediatetly try >>turning >>> > >the >>> > >pins starting with the 17/64 and ending with the treated >>pin.......wait >>a >>> > >few >>> > >hours and try turning the pins again....set the test aside for a week >>or >>> so >>> > >and then try the pins again...let us know what you find OK? >>> > > >>> > > >>> > >>> > _________________________________________________________________ >>> > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com >>> > >>> > >>> >
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