An EBVT Quest 2/Unequal Temperaments

Billbrpt@AOL.COM Billbrpt@AOL.COM
Fri, 9 Jun 2000 09:53:55 EDT


In a message dated 6/9/00 8:15:30 AM Central Daylight Time, 
pianoola9@hotmail.com (Ola Andersson) writes:

<< I think B3 is "hanging in the air" do you have a test for it espesially to 
 E4
 I usally gets unhappy with the E major chord when I finish the temprement.>>

Just make sure that the G3-B3 3rd is exactly the same as the F3-A3 3rd, the 
C4-E4 3rd and the G3-E4 6th and it will be in the right place.  The B3-E4 4th 
will beat faster than you are used to in ET but the F#3-B3 4th will be closer 
to pure.  The G3-D4 5th and the A3-D4 4th will also beat more strongly than 
you are used to.  Do not let this concern you.  You will find that when you 
play these intervals in the context of a chord, the tempering that seems more 
pronounced than you would like to hear is "swallowed" or absorbed somehow.  
That is to say, you hear it when you play an isolated interval but you don't 
in a musical context.  That is one of the benefits of Equal Beating, it's 
canceling out effect.

Remember too, that E major has 4 sharps and thus it is entering the bottom of 
the Cycle of 5ths.  You expect it to be a more vibrant key.  If you look for 
literature written in this key, you will find that inevitably, it will be 
music where a strong melody is important rather than the harmonious stillness 
expected from the keys at the top of the cycle of 5ths.
 
 >
 >Please let us know how your pianos sound when tuned this way.
 >
 >Bill Bremmer RPT
 >Madison, Wisconsin
 
<< I really like the sound of my piano this way. Perhaps it's because I'm a 
 bass player I find this tuning to be more in tune than ET. Sounds funny but 
 I found it true. I will measure it when I have finished to ask my questions 
 to see if I am close enough.  Anyhow I found tuning HT is a good training 
 for tuning ET. It trains me in hearing thirds and fifths with different 
speed. 
 Helps me correcting ET.
 
 Tack så mycket
 
 Ola Andersson >>

Thank you very much for your observation.  It has been mine as well.  It has 
often been pointed out recently how one temperament cannot be thought of as 
"better" than the other but there is more involved here than temperament 
alone.  The way the octaves are tuned according to the Equal Beating 
principal is just as important to the final outcome as the temperament.  This 
is why I have consistently refused to find the FAC type Correction Figures 
for this temperament.  The results would not be the same as if it were tuned 
by ear using the Equal Beating Tempered octaves.

In my response to the "Unequal Temperament" thread, I asked if it did not 
make sense to also vary the octaves as well as the temperament.  None of the 
smooth curve calculations can do this.  True to form from someone who does 
not know how to do this and who has never done this (as easy as it is to do), 
the blanket statement that it does not make sense was made, then the question 
avoided entirely:

<<<<>>If the temperament you are using has irregularly tempered intervals, 
does 
it 
not also make sense that you may want to "temper" your octaves a little 
differently as well?  <<

   No,  that doesn't make any sense.  On any reasonably well made grand 
piano, I haven't found there to be any appreciable difference between an 
aural recreation of any of these temperaments (by following the Jorgensen 
rules for tuning),  and using the FAC correction numbers.  The differences 
being given as reasons for aural temperament tuning are so small as to be 
disregarded.  If a room full of technicians can mistakenly identify a 
Victorian tuning for ET, ( documented by Jim Coleman), then the differences 
between a machine HT and an aural HT mean absolutely nothing at all to a 
practical musician.  >>>>

The octaves created by the Equal Beating method may be essentially the same 
as one of the smooth curve calculations when tuning ET but not when tuning a 
Cycle of 5ths based temperament.  It is the *combination* of a temperament 
loaded with Equal Beating properties AND the Equal Beating octaves that 
create such astounding clarity and such a pleasing resonance.  No 
historically documented temperament nor any other contemporary temperament 
has quite the same set of properties and absolutely no Electronic Tuning 
program can reproduce the same kind of octaves.

Thank you very much for your interest and I wish you good luck in mastering 
this way of tuning a piano.  It makes all of that dialing in of figures and 
then applying "deviations of the deviations" such a waste of time because 
that method ends up missing the mark, if only slightly.  Yes, it is true that 
many professionals are doing the HT's and other temperaments this way but 
that does not mean that there is not a better way that as it turns out, is 
easier, less tedious and less prone to error.  By the way, it is possible to 
use the SAT to tune the octaves this way and to have exactly the same results 
as when constructing them be ear but not, definitely NOT when using an FAC 
program.

Bill Bremmer RPT
Madison, Wisconsin


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