Andre, Here, my friend we disagree and I hope you hear me out and consider my point. I, like most others on this list hated to see you get chased off about the hammer felt fiasco. I defended you and really regretted what happened. BUT... This is where I think we disagree and where many folks just don't stop to think... Many, many years ago (an old book or movie will remind us of this) people for the most part (in your country and mine) knew what hospitality and politeness and consideration were. This was when men stood to offer a lady his seat and where everyone (those that were respected) thought of others before they spoke. When a man's word was his honor. As our societies have evolved I'm afraid we have become more and more callused to other people's feelings, to what is acceptable, to what is allowed, to what is considered "too far". We have become a world that craves blood, gossip, the bizarre, etc. (just look at the death of Diana, tabloids, many of the new music groups, what people are attracted to on television, etc., etc.) It is only natural for us....We naturally WANT these things. It is only with self control, honor, and discipline that we resist. I may want to make foul bodily noises in a restaurant, but I don't. Where do we stop and control ourselves?? When is too much, too much? To slip and apologize is OK. To know it would offend, do it anyway, then defend it as some study of language is absurd and a weak defense. I may love fouls smells, but I would not inflict mine on others. Should I expect others to be "tolerant" as you say. Why should I inflict myself on others. I was not Terribly offended by the word and almost responded to it myself (because I am FRENCH) Like you, I knew others would be offended and I knew it was small and not necessary - why do it? Too high a price for a silly laugh. The ONLY reason I write you is that you said that you thought others would be offended, but you went on anyway. If we rationalize this behavior now, what will we be defending years from now? This world is sliding enough without us helping it. We used to have more respect and consideration for others. And for ourselves. In our country we debate this all the time: People want tolerance from others for the things that they want to "do". What about tolerance for those that find it offensive?? Someone may want me to be tolerant of their profanity in a public place, but they have no consideration for my feelings, or those of my small children in their presence. I cannot delete the word before it reaches my ears/eyes or my young children's ears/eyes. Lets talk about pianos. Maybe that is one of the few things we have in common. This list and the world needs tolerance, tempered with consideration, decency, and patience for others. When in doubt, don't say it.....I'm done. Lance Lafargue, RPT New Orleans Chapter Covington, LA. lafargue@iamerica.net ---------- > From: Antares <antares@EURONET.NL> > To: pianotech@ptg.org > Subject: Have a wonderful day too! > Date: Sunday, November 23, 1997 3:49 PM > > >Subject: Re: pos versus piece of merde..Lord have mercy > >Sent: 11/23/97 21:22 > >To: CheetoLD@aol.com > > > >>I know exactly what I said...it's called irony...and if I did offend someone, > >>sorry! :-) > > Antares answers: > > Well well... > Dear Colleagues, > > Last night I noticed that another conflict started because of the use of "profanity and vulgar language". > > As I am involved, I will certainly come forward and show my colors. > > I <<<< reacted to Calebs post because I am : > a. always interested in language questions (that's why I wrote "Ah...I like that!) > and > b.because I immediately thought of the fairly new Parisian subscriber to the List. > > So..I was really wondering if the French word "Merde" means the same as "shit" in English. > That's why I suggested that we could ask our French colleague, because *he* is French.... and *I* am not. > As a matter of fact, I intuitively felt that the words "Merde" and "shit" could cause an uproar among *certain* subscribers on this list , so, for that reason I decided to use "Lord have mercy" as a header for my post, and/but..also, meant as a jolly way of saying that these are "bad" words.....so, "Please...Lord, forgive me"! > > Now... > of course....... everything went wrong. > And, that is how conflicts and wars start. > > To avoid these kind of conflicts, I should not have reacted the way I did. > > As I gave an explaination for the way I meant what I said (last night), I wish for those who feel insulted by my post that they will now have at least a better understanding how words can be "mistaken". > > But...I have something else to say as well: > > If we start a conflict because of a few words, then I am beginning to wonder about just one word: > What comes to my mind now, is the word "tolerance"....... > If we would have the capacity for only a very tiny bit of tolerance, it is then not *immediately* necessary to jump up and crucify a "supposed offender and >insulting< person". > As I explained before in this here letter to those who feel insulted and hurt , I was actually really *only* interested in the language issue. > > Ah! but! Hey!.....As the Pianotech list was, and is, meant for pianotech issues only, I was most wrong to react to Calebs >(final)< line about "pos versus piece of merde". > On the other hand, I take the liberty (although I sense that I should have been tortured, burned, and buried by now already) to imagine that I am allowed to say that my posts to the List usually refer to the Piano business only. > > More over, during this past year, I have become more and more guarded about my participation on this "list". (Some subscribers even suggested I should take part on the list a little more frequently) > This has to do with the fact that not so long ago (in my sensitive memory) I was flamed by a considerable number of subscribers for venturing > my < ideas about the difference in treating hammerfelt in the USA and in Europe. > > The fact that I seem to be in the doghouse once again makes me feel weary. > I sttill am a subscriber to "the List" and I still like to imagine myself being a *foreign* and distant member of the pianotech "family". > > That's why I think I can say yet one more thing: > When robots are programmed very well, like smooth running computers, they will behave in a most perfect way, like real "Science Fiction robots" should. > I, on the other hand, I am a human being and *not* a robot. > Just like my antique computer (built by humans) , I have some flaws and sometimes my (human) behaviour becomes erratic. > When I'm being confronted with an error in my computer I sometimes have to crash or just shut it down, and start it all over again, hoping it will perform better the next time. > The same thing happens to me sometimes, I am a lesser example of Humankind, I make mistakes, I crash, but..... I start all over again. > > Just let me remind you, offended colleagues, I am not the only human being on this world! > So....hey! have some mercy......(some of you should know all about that.) > > PS. > I dared to come out and offer to you my version of this "POS" story. > If there is anybody who wishes that I should end my participation to "the List", let him or her *openly* announce this. If the number of objectors becomes sifnificant, I will > definitely < take the consequenses. > But I'll count to ten first > > Have a wonderful day too...... > > > Friendly greetings from : > > CONCERT PIANO SERVICE > André Oorebeek > Amsterdam, the Netherlands > > ‰ where MUSIC is no harm can be ‰ > > > > >
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