Jeff, Some good questions and a very good reply from Fred Sturm, but I have some observations and questions too. You present the situation in the vaguest of terms: - "a chamber group of some sort". Lexington High School wind ensemble? Boston Chamber Players? Tashi? Vienna? - " they routinely play at 441 or 442". Well, which is it? If they're so particular, they must know. - The piano seems to be a Steinway D, but the venue is unspecified. Concert hall? School? Someone's home? Who is in charge of the piano? and who is responsible for paying? - The piano had not been tuned since October. While you humidity isn't as low as what we have now in the northeast - regularly below 14%, (within the accuracy tolerances of Pianotek's current offering), you still had to do some sort of pitch raise, so whether to 440 or 441 (region) shouldn't make all that much difference. While the only political pressure to actually lower pitch standard to below 440 is coming from outer fringe elements, my sense of current 'standard' is between 440 and 442, however, I've heard stories recently that suggest that such stated standards may not always reflect reality, even from the initial tuning. There's a lot of psychology and insecurity at work here. Just make sure you're paid and that someone else is responsible. David Skolnik Hastings on Hudson, NY At 03:02 PM 2/20/2010, you wrote: >Hi, >This week, I was asked by a chamber group of some sort to tune to >441. I was told the reason was that the clarinet pushes sharp as it >warms up, and for that reason, they routinely play at 441 or 442. It >was a bit of a pitch raise. The piano hadn't been tuned since this >same group performed in October when the relative humidity was in >the 70s. This week, it was 28%. It had not been tuned before their >rehearsal the day of the performance. (Oddly, they had really only >complained of the tuning of F21 -- yes, the lowest tenor note on a >S&S D, and it was about 12 or 16 cents low, beating pretty wildly >against F33, which was maybe 6 cents low) I hemmed and hawed a bit >and tried to explain about humidity and stability, but they were >uncaring about the piano - just the clarinet. I tuned the piano as >requested, but I'm really struggling with the credibility of the request. > >First, if they start at 441 and everything goes sharp from there, >why not start at 442? If that's not high enough, why not 443 or 445? >What's to stop the upward progression? I did not think to ask >whether the performers tuned to an offstage pitch source, or tuned >to the piano once on stage. But, if they're tuning to the piano once >on stage, what is there to stop the upward push of the pitch, no >matter where the piano is tuned? And, during which part of the >performance is it more important for the clarinet to be in tune with >the piano? If the clarinet pitch moves around, what does it matter >where you start, if you're not going to end up together anyway? Or, >is it more important to start out of tune, so you can end up >there? Whose responsibility is it to stay in tune? > >Second (and I'm playing stupid here), I distinctly remember that >clarinets have tuning adjustments. They can be retuned a heck of a >lot faster than pianos. Doesn't it seem to be the responsibility of >the player who plays the non-fixed pitch instrument to keep in tune >with the fixed-pitch ones? Can this be the result of spending hours >and hours of time rehearsing alone? As a singer, I sometimes push >gently sharp without a reference, just staying "on top of the >pitch". The piano helps keep me in line. Why is it the >responsibility of the piano to change pitch for the clarinet? > >Third, why does the clarinet go sharp as it warms up? Don't all >other wind instruments go flat? I remember my trombone would always >be sharp when it was cold. Would it make sense that as the emboucher >fatigues, the player might compensate with more air pressure, which >would explain the push sharp? Therefore, would the pitch going sharp >be the fault of the instrument or the player? And, I come back to >this same question, regardless of the reason the clarinet pushes >sharp (if it does), why should the piano or the pitch standard be >held responsible? > >I'm just curious. Seems like if we allow the non-fixed pitch >musicians request non-440 tunings, there would be no standard to >keep it from just flying away. I really wanted to ask the players >to tune down to 438 or 439 for the sake of the piano because when >the humidity goes back up, the piano is going to push way sharp. >Seems to me that request would have been as credible as the one made of me. > >End of rant, comments appreciated, privately even, if you wish. >Jeff Tanner -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://ptg.org/pipermail/caut.php/attachments/20100221/cd3bcf5b/attachment-0001.htm>
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