[CAUT] Tone "contrast"; Was - The "new" S&S Hammers.

[Jim Busby]

Hi Ric, others,

At the same concert (original post) I mentioned to two Steinway techs in
attendance that there seemed to be "no contrast of tone". (I won't
mention their names). Both said the same thing... "That's right, and
it's not really what we're after at Steinway". 

While there may be no "one way" to voice it's revealing to me that Eric
S., Ron C., Scott J. and John P. have all voiced pianos I've listened to
and they all are VERY similar. Vince is also of that school. John Patten
and Eric both made the comment that all Steinway C&A techs pretty much
do things the same way, or at least get to the same standard in tuning,
voicing and regulation. 

Maybe I'm an idiot saying this but "pretty pianos" (like the rebuilds I
mentioned at the convention) bore me after a while. I keep waiting for
the ff sections to blow my hair back or move me emotionally, but they
don't. 

Jim Busby BYU


-----Original Message-----
From: caut-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of
Richard Brekne
Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2007 2:43 AM
To: caut at ptg.org
Subject: [CAUT] Tone "contrast"; Was - The "new" S&S Hammers.


This too is an excellent commentary to my mind Jim. It is without a 
doubt true that preferences for what piano sound should be vary 
widely... wildly perhaps. Which in turn is a very strong motivator for 
having full control over the entire process of hanging, regulating, and 
voicing a new set of hammers.  If you know everything that has been 
done, then making adjustments to deal with individual pianist needs as 
they arise...even accounting for such adjustment as part of the 
installation process is more easily accomplished. You know whats been 
done before, and how to counter or enhance as the needs arise.

I also had the experience of hearing some rebuilt pianos at an earlier 
convention. And tho impressed by some of the fine workmanship and the 
willingness to forward alternative sound pictures, found that all in all

most of the pianos did not meet with my own personal tastes. Some were 
beautiful... but as you say tame and without much contrast in sound at 
different levels.

There seems to be a growing desire amoungst several rebuilders in the 
states to opt for a very moody and softish sound base. The idea that a 
super ppp level should be needed goes to the expense of any real 
brilliance, seemingly because these same equate that kind of brilliance 
with noise.  It matters not that the vast majority of pianists seem to 
on the other hand opt for that kind of brilliant sound base.  On the one

hand, I applaud the willingness to explore different colour pallets, yet

on the other hand I am skeptical to the apparent insistance of some to 
declare their own ideas as superior others, writing off clear market 
preferences as meaningless in a variety of ways.

I liked especially your closing sentence Jim.  A piano should be able to

get mean.  A piano is for the audience listening as well as the pianist 
playing.  Only a few instruments need to be tamed a bit for use in the 
audio microscope a sound recording studio is.  The tendancy to voice 
overly pretty was described by both the Japanese and Hamburg academy 
voicing instructors as a typical misconception that beginning voicers 
fall into.  I'm not sure I'd go that far.... but the willingness to push

the upper limits of piano power should IMHO be the base line. 

Cheers
RicB


    Alan,

    I put a set on a D last month and I still had to add juice. Not
being as
    experienced with these hammers as some of you, I got Vince to give a
    listen and he had me put in even more juice!

    There seems to be quite a range of what people think constitutes
good
    tone in a hammer. I rely on Vince's experience (both Eric S., Scott
    Jones and others think very highly of his voicing) and the
difference
    seems to be that the Steinway folks (and Vince) want "contrast" in
tone
    color, not just a "pretty sound" that can get louder and softer yet
    still has the same basic timbre.

    The sound I heard at a previous convention (from rebuilt S&S pianos)
had
    no contrast! On the other hand Vince's pianos can get the most
sublime
    pp and an almost, but not really, harsh/nasty ff. It has a true
color
    contrast that concert pianist who have played here have raved about.
At
    the PNWC Scott Jones couldn't say enough good things about the old M
    that Vince voiced for me. Later, Eric Schandall came by and glowed
about
    it. BTW, it was a 1967 M right next to a brand new M voiced
"pretty". No
    contest! A piano should be able to get mean if the music requires
it. I
    don't know how else to express it in words...

    JMHO - FWIW.

    Jim Busby BYU